6G Celicas Forums

I own a 94 GT, body type ST204. I am interested in putting in a 3SGTE. I'm doing research, and I would love for anyone and everyone to give me any advice on which model 3SGTE would be compatible with my car and what I would need to do to complete the swap.

All models 3sgte will work.

It also depends on the availability of the engines.

It would be the best to get teh 3sgte out of the 1994 & up GTfour celica if possible. ST205.

If not, the ST185 carries the 2nd generation 3sgte.The St205 is the 3rd gen.

If you are planning to go fwd drive, you do not need much except a FWD Trans.

If you planning to go rwd, you have to get the dirve shaft and the whole back maybe from an mr2 or from a celica GTfour st205. I do not know if the ST185 rear end would help you.

Four wheel drive will be easy, but can be troublesome if would have problems cutting and welding.

The best person you can talk to is Charlie97L.

I will check here in Barbados and see what FWD trans thse guys use down here.

We have some corolla and Levins that have 3sgte swaps in them.

To my opinion, there wasn't any tracking lost.

There ringe on 17 with 215+ size high grip tires.

But there are bone stock compare to mods need to attain 300HP.

Toysport.com, fensport.com are 2 very well know companies that can help you with a swap.

Fensport is in England, so cost maybe a factor, but I personnally like fensport.

Contact both and you will see.

Does it seem like there are alot of ppl asking about this swap?...im getting disappointed - its going to turn into the B16 swaps - common

haha common? hardly, celicas alone arent common, let alone ones with engine swaps! and if everyone actually DID everything they talked about, im sure alot of our cars would look ALOT different.

Hey you don't have to be such an ass. If you don't like it then why don't you go whine about it somewhere else. I'm just interested and looking for help, and your reply didn't really give me too much insight.

QUOTE (jrg @ Apr 30, 2003 - 7:57 PM)

Hey you don't have to be such an ass. If you don't like it then why don't you go whine about it somewhere else. I'm just interested and looking for help, and your reply didn't really give me too much insight.

IRQ calm the **** down... you don't know who you are talking to, we praise this guy.... (me too someday)

LOL



-> and for your engine swap, anyone of the 3sgte (excluding st165-gen I) would work,

your lucky that you have GT, since it's direct swap - using stock mounts and stock trans...

trans you can upgrade later with MR-2 (cable 5-speed trans), but don't have to...

-You are going to get a front mount intercooler for engine to last (unless you get GT-4,

or custom hood, cause of the scoop)....

-You also have to get the ECU either new one of reprogram your old one.....


--- the best way / easiest way is to get the FRONT end clip of a GT-4 Celi, reason why

because with that you are making sure that you won't be missing any parts....



hope this helps you, and have some respect for SENIOR Celi owners around here, LOL

QUOTE (Supersprynt @ Apr 30, 2003 - 6:54 PM)

Does it seem like there are alot of ppl asking about this swap?...im getting disappointed - its going to turn into the B16 swaps - common

Yeah its true that a lot of people are asking about this swap, but thats all they're are doing "ASKING." I'll admitt i was one of those people. But compared to how much this swap is to the B16 or B18 swap, its no match! It took me over a year to save up for this swap, and I'm still short by a few bucks.

And yeah our celicas are very rare. When ever i go to the races (illegal) i'm the only celica there, ONLY TOYOTA. Only every blue moon there is a MR2, buts thats still rare. This project takes time and money, so i wouldn't worry about it becoming a B16/18 swap anytime soon.

QUOTE (jrg @ Apr 30, 2003 - 10:57 PM)

Hey you don't have to be such an ass. If you don't like it then why don't you go whine about it somewhere else. I'm just interested and looking for help, and your reply didn't really give me too much insight.

Lets back the truck up here - are they calling me an ass? And you guys praise me? Just a lil confused, ne ways: back to the subject. If ur talking to me I dont think i was being an ass, i was merely stating that in the last week, it seems like alot of people have asked the same question your asking right now, seems like a surge in 3sgte ideas. Never did i say i didnt like it, and like what exactly? The 3sgte? I love it, in fact, its sitting in my car now. I've been very impressed by the people of this forum because everyone has been very civil to eachother and if ur going to start shizit then maybe you should go sit in the corner til u got ur head on straight and realize if u make enemies in this place ur not going to get anywhere cuz this site and the people that participate are the probably the pioneers of the 6g in the entire country.

And you guys are right about the rareness of the Celica, how dare i compare it to hondas

This post has been edited by Supersprynt: May 1, 2003 - 10:01 AM

Yeah jrq, you should just relax and take it easy. If you want some more information, you can take a look at this thread for more information on the 3S-GTE.

Most people go with a JDM ST185 second generation 3S-GTE.

QUOTE (Coomer @ May 1, 2003 - 10:11 AM)

Most people go with a JDM ST185 second generation 3S-GTE.

That is so beacuse the St185 is more readily available than the st205.

It is like here. Everyone wants a 4AGE20 black top and not the silver top.

So when you go to engines dealers, you just see lots and lots of 20v silver pile up and not one 20v black top

I wonder if ne body has done the 4th Gen 3sgte swap...the Caldina is basically the Matrix in the U.S....maybe we'll get a AllTrac Matrix w/3sgte??

Hello guys,
New to the board, just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. I have a 90 Celica ST185 thats 90% finished in a ST205 engine / trans upgrade ( i'm doing the work myself, so its taking forever).

With the ST205 front clip I ordered, I received the entire rear diff assembly (rear diff, axels, entire sub-frame and all the suspension arms). To my surprise, then entire thing bolted right up to my ST185, they are identical!

Going a step further, I jacked up my wife's 96 ST and checked it out. I have the ST205 center drive shaft, and the bolt holes for the support are there, and line up. Unfortunately, the rear frame that supports the rear diff sub-frame is not there. It may be possible to take the rear frame from the ST185 and weld it on to the ST202, but thats not a task I will take on anytime soon.

From experience, there are some advantaged and disadvantaged to using the ST205. The disadvantages are in sourcing parts. The exhaust manifold gasket and valve cover manifold gasket are not available in the US. And for future performance, finding a 3rd gen aftermarket exhaust manifold is extremely difficult.

On the other hand, the power capability of the 3rd gen is far supierior. A place in Chicago did a flow test on the 2nd gen and 3rd gen heads, and the 3rd gen out flowed the 2nd by 45%. After porting/polishing and upgrading the valves on the 2nd gen, the 3rd gen still matched it.

I agree with zigy 100% - get a full clip. You can always sell off the extra parts.

No turbo for me, it's all about the N/A response. 230-240 hp out of a 4 cyl N/A? That's power for ya Wish I could get a 4th gen 3SGE, that'd be sweet, but they're so freakin rare in the states. Damn importers...

Gotta love toyota - makin things pretty easy on us.

OK OK OK maybe I got a little too upset at Supersprynt. I'm sorry. I really appreciate all the help from you guys. This really is an awesome site.

Aight - we're straight then.

QUOTE

With the ST205 front clip I ordered, I received the entire rear diff assembly (rear diff, axels, entire sub-frame and all the suspension arms). To my surprise, then entire thing bolted right up to my ST185, they are identical! Going a step further, I jacked up my wife's 96 ST and checked it out. I have the ST205 center drive shaft, and the bolt holes for the support are there, and line up. Unfortunately, the rear frame that supports the rear diff sub-frame is not there. It may be possible to take the rear frame from the ST185 and weld it on to the ST202, but thats not a task I will take on anytime soon.

Thanks for this reply.. I have waited for a long time for someone else to look into this and post about it.. just so I people will understand that this conversion isnt that hard to do... as for makin the st205 allwheel.. all you have to do is relocate the gas tank,cut the floor board a little and theres a little wielding to mount everything but its not that hard to do.

As for the original question:

your best bet is to get the st185 either JDM or USDM. strictly because its the easiest to get parts for and the price to Hp ratio is the best outta all of the 3sgte choices... DO NOT USE THE MR2 one.. granted it will work but its a bish to make the Ecu work in a 6th gen.

Also with the st185 you can just go to your locale toyota dealer and order replacement parts.. you can do this for the st205 but to get the parts for it there expensive.. trust me I got one... I usally just order the st185 parts and most of the time they work fine


Also since you own a GT I wouldnt bother with a full clip cuz you really dont need it.. just make sure that the place you get the motor from doenst just CUT the wiring harness.. make sure they take the time to unplug the whole thing and give it to you intact.. granted you will have to cut it and lengthen it newayz but its alot eaiser to keep track of what goes to what when its all intact to begin with.

As for the transmission options:

FWD - use the tranny from a 3sge... It will bolt up and handle the power.

U can also use ur stock one but there has been question as to how well it will hold up to the power

AWD.. sorce a 5th gen and use the whole drive train assembly

QUOTE (scothaniel @ May 1, 2003 - 11:00 AM)

It may be possible to take the rear frame from the ST185 and weld it on to the ST202, but thats not a task I will take on anytime soon.

the ST's are not st202's

they are AT200's

edit:

also i dont know how neverstop's set up is working. his theory is correct. but a lot of people would suggest to swapping in the floor to make it safer.

its not that i am disagreeing with neverstop or anything. i have not seen his set up so i dont know how it is working...

but ya i would say if you have the money and want it to be like the factory then get a front/rear clip from www.jarcoinc.com for 4500 and swap out the gas tank...trunk pan...and floor pans...

This post has been edited by GT2GT4: May 2, 2003 - 12:35 AM

this thread is the greatest!!! i've had to turn my brain on overdrive to absorb it all but it's soooooooooo worth it!

anyway, i know how alot of you guys kinda look down on people who just "ask" about swapping business but i am so interested by it that i'm am for sure going to accomplish the almighty 3SGTE swap someday (as soon as i get my car and the funds )

anyway, i've spent ALOT of time speculating about the swap and i just wanted some opinions and maybe some clarification on my ideas/plans

when i get my car and the money for the swap (which is probably what i'll save up to do almost as soon as i get the car) i was thinking that i would keep the stock hood from the 6th gen celica, but since the ST185 top mounted intercooler doesn't fit properly without the GT-4 hood, how would i get around this? i've heard that some people relocate the intercooler to the front of the engine bay to get around this problem. plus since the intercooler kind of needs the hood grill to vent air would the engine heat soak because of the lack of ventilation?... is keeping the stock hood feasible?

also, because i'm kind of thinking of this plan in a linear fashion (i.e. what i'll do first, second, third... etc...) should i have anything done to the car, like performance exaust or intake, before i have the swap done?

ummm... i'm planning on getting a front clip of the ST185 so if i get lucky and it comes with all of the rear bits for AWD would it be hard to convert? i was thinking before that i wanted to convert the car from FWD to AWD but i had posted something on www.toyotacelicaweb.com and was told there that it was WAY to costly to do... but here it kind of seems common place and equally as expensive as keeping the car FF.

thank you in advance, this forum is great for everything celica!!!

I know that the st205 clip is highly recommended, but you might consider the st185 because its cheaper and (correct me if I'm wrong) would have smog equipment and parts would be more available in the states.