my 5SFTE turbo project, 300+whp PG 23!!!!!!! Options

[presure2]

hey guys, since i've been fielding alot of questions about turboing the 5s, and most of the links in the 5sfte sticky are dead, i figured i start a thread about the buildup of my kit, and try to include as many details as possible, so everyone can learn a little more about what exactly goes into a setup like this. ill keep updating the threads and adding pics and stuff as i upload more ect..
im not gonna get into the whole why not swap a 3s instead debate here, thats a dead issue as far as im concerned. (not that i think swapping is a bad idea, just not for me.)
so, ill start off by saying the single most important thing you can do if you wanna turbo your 5s is RESEARCH! take your time, learn about the diffrent systems that all work together to make a good kit work. go to www.howstuffworks.com and find out how EVERYTHING works, it'll make understanding the hows and whys of everything so much easier. i've been reserching about this for 2+yrs and i STILL learn new things everyday.
#2 is DONT BE CHEAP...can you do it cheap? yea..will it last? prolly not.
thats gotta be the SINGLE biggest mistake i see EVERYONE make. cheap out on all the little stuff, and it WILL come back to haunt you in the end
that said, i decided i wanted to turbo my 5s. lol
so, off on the hunt i went...parts lists, install sites, the burien kit...i searched it ALLLLLL...for MONTHS!! talking to people, looking at sites, printing info..basicly what the old timers call "goin to the woodshed"
then, i started looking for parts:
3s exhaust manifold, ct-26 turbo, oil hard lines, elbow and primary cat (also known as a downpipe), if your not planning on getting a aftermarket downpipe. also the oil pan and 2bar map sensor.
your gonna want these off of a 2nd gen 3sgte from a 90-93 alltrac or mr2T, and are pretty easy finds over on www.alltrac.net and or www.mr2oc.com. if your not a member of these 2 sites, YOU SHOULD BE!!! theres a wealth of info on these to sites, and while alot of it may not be 5sfte spacific, its still VERY good info, especially the 90-99 mr2/ 3sgte forum.
next was injectors. there is ALOT of confusion here, where to find them, what they look like, what size are they really ect.
what we're looking for is the MKIII N/A supra injectors. not turbo injectors, not alltrac injectors, N/A MKIII supra. theyre a lime green color, and 315cc. just to clear up another point of confusion, they do NOT become bigger injectors in our cars. the fuel pressure between the n/a supra and the 5s is the SAME.
there is a pic in the 5sfte sticky of what they look like and the flow tests to show it.
i found mine on ebay, but you can sometimes find them on some of the boards ive mentioned, and the supraforums.
also, i really reccomend having the injectors cleaned and balanced once you get them, if you look closley at the printout for my injectors in the sticky from when i had them cleaned and balanced, youll see why i say this.
one of my injectors wasnt even spraying, it was DRIPPING before it was cleaned. i'd HATE to see what would happen if i'd installed that thing in there and cranked up the boost!
so yea, i really cant stress enough, HAVE YOUR INJECTORS CLEANED BEFORE YOU INSTALL THEM!!! www.rceng.com did an excelent job on mine for about 100$, and ive heard thru the mr2 board that www.witchhunter.com also does a very good job, and are only 12$ per injector.

EDIT!!! 315CC injectors are TOO SMALL for use in a turbo 5sfe. 460cc rx7 injectors are a drop in replacement and are discribed later in this post!!!


you'll also need to upgrade your fuel pump, use the 255lph walboro supra pump. you can get it for under 100 usually on ebay., and pretty much bolts in.
next for me was the intercooler..now contrary to popular belief, bigger IS NOT always better when it comes to intercoolers.
you wanna choose the smallest intercooler to fit your needs, with a LITTLE room for growth. for instance, in my case, my goal is around 190-200whp for now, so i chose a intercooler thats 26x6x3 overall length, with endtanks. its good for up to 300hp. why not somthing bigger? well, the #1 reason is theres no NEED for anything bigger. lol the bigger you go, the more pressure drop you have, and thats not what we want. with all the piping invloved for a 5sfte FMIC, the last then we want is some big honking core, sucking up 2-3 or more psi of the boost we wanna get to our engines.
for the piping, again, bigger is NOT always better. 2" or 2.25 " is more than sufficent for us. you'll need to buy pre-bent lengths and cut and fit them for your particular setup. jcwhitney is cheap for aluminized steel, or burns stainless if you want stainless pipes.
then the noise maker of the bunch , the BOV...your choice here, i chose the HKS SSQV... got it from ebay for 190+ shipping i think it was..just make sure your buying the real thing if its from ebay, theres alot of shady copys floating around. youll also need a mounting flange to have welded to your intercooler piping, make sure you get the correct size and material to match your piping.
TOO BE CONTINUED...

This post has been edited by presure2: Nov 11, 2007 - 10:53 AM

[Ravie1]

*snif snif* *Teary eyes* I think i love you Pressure. This has by far been the best turbo 5S guide i have ever seen, Thank you Thank You Thank you!!!
I hope its still alive because after seeing this now ive made up my mind on (dont laugh) Turboing my Camry!!! this guide , like someone has said earlier, has inspired me on turboing this engine. I had my doubts, but you running 2+ years with it proves the flamers wrong. I love my camry, and ive put a lot of money in it, and i just wanna be unique. (WTF?? was that a flipping turbo in that thing that just past me?!?!) ive always wanted to do a project like this and with this guide i can!! Im starting my build slowly and over the next few months ill put it together, and hopfeully drop it in my cam for the summer.

Okay business.

The oil supply line, is 1/4 inch too big? and i have high pressure hydraulic hoses (like 3500Psi) and fittings.

does anyone know anywhere i can find some forged pistons? connecting rods and a crank for the 5S? im planning to go a little higher on the boost.

and Pressure, what piggyback are you using? which do you suggest is better and is a msd btm necessary?

the oil filter relocation, is that a MUST ? not clear on that.

what size of piping should i use?

hmm i think thats it for now...sorry for being a total noob. but i want to do it properly.

Thanks.

[presure2]

*snif snif* *Teary eyes* I think i love you Pressure. This has by far been the best turbo 5S guide i have ever seen, Thank you Thank You Thank you!!!
I hope its still alive because after seeing this now ive made up my mind on (dont laugh) Turboing my Camry!!! this guide , like someone has said earlier, has inspired me on turboing this engine. I had my doubts, but you running 2+ years with it proves the flamers wrong. I love my camry, and ive put a lot of money in it, and i just wanna be unique. (WTF?? was that a flipping turbo in that thing that just past me?!?!) ive always wanted to do a project like this and with this guide i can!! Im starting my build slowly and over the next few months ill put it together, and hopfeully drop it in my cam for the summer.

Okay business.

The oil supply line, is 1/4 inch too big? and i have high pressure hydraulic hoses (like 3500Psi) and fittings.

does anyone know anywhere i can find some forged pistons? connecting rods and a crank for the 5S? im planning to go a little higher on the boost.

and Pressure, what piggyback are you using? which do you suggest is better and is a msd btm necessary?

the oil filter relocation, is that a MUST ? not clear on that.

what size of piping should i use?

hmm i think thats it for now...sorry for being a total noob. but i want to do it properly.

Thanks.

no larger than 3/16 for the feed line.
je ect make pistons for the 5s.
3s rods are your best bet, the 5s crank is good for 400whp+, have the 5s rod jorunals turned down to accept the 3s rods.
BTM not needed.
im using the emanage ultimate.
piping for IC 2.25 or 2.5" is fine.
good luck.

[jazzcornet]

very nice write up!!! us MR2 guys do it a bit differently, but your way is definately a sure fire wy to stay safe!

[conv95celica]

will a aem fuel ignition controller be okay instead of an emangement system . what intercooler size fits best?
thanks for the help. hopefullly be runnnin the turbo in the next 3 weeks
Josh

[presure2]

will a aem fuel ignition controller be okay instead of an emangement system . what intercooler size fits best?
thanks for the help. hopefullly be runnnin the turbo in the next 3 weeks
Josh

i dont know anything about the system, but if you can control fuel with it, it "should" work.
26X6X3 is the size of my IC.

[conv95celica]

so i am about to flipout cause before i found this form i ordered a turbo kit from ssautochrome. i swear if its a bunch of crap i will drive six hours up to their shop and demand a refund. so much for being closer to gettin a turbo on the conv. celica

[6strngs]

so i am about to flipout cause before i found this form i ordered a turbo kit from ssautochrome. i swear if its a bunch of crap i will drive six hours up to their shop and demand a refund. so much for being closer to gettin a turbo on the conv. celica

most SSAutochrome and XS power stuff is carp. sorry. I've been using an SSautochrom downpipe though with no problems. I think the wastegate door hits it when it opens but I don't get a lot of boost creep.

[presure2]

so i am about to flipout cause before i found this form i ordered a turbo kit from ssautochrome. i swear if its a bunch of crap i will drive six hours up to their shop and demand a refund. so much for being closer to gettin a turbo on the conv. celica

good luck trying to get a refund out of them.
most people cannot even get in contact with them once the order is paid for.

[DEATH]

so i am about to flipout cause before i found this form i ordered a turbo kit from ssautochrome. i swear if its a bunch of crap i will drive six hours up to their shop and demand a refund. so much for being closer to gettin a turbo on the conv. celica

good luck trying to get a refund out of them.
most people cannot even get in contact with them once the order is paid for.

Yep - I've been there done that [or rather didn't get a refund or a response]

[conv95celica]

so good news i stopped the payment before it went through. but if i wouldnt read that before midnight tonight i woulda been outa that money. so thank you guys for commenting about that ****ty website or i woulda been screwed. anyone got links for aftermarket manifold and i wana t3/4 turbo as well.
thanks

[DEATH]

Just use the 3S-GTE manifold for now [it's good for way more HP than your gonna run anyway] with a CT-26 to *your intended turbo* adapter. It's dependable, made for your car [kind of] and cheap/easy to find.
In fact, if it was me, I'd run as many 3S stock components as possible [with the exception of fuel injectors (which won't even fit), fuel pump etc.] for my initial setup/tuning process. The CT-26 or a rebuilt variation [like Manny has - CT-27 from ATS etc.] is perfect for the beginner 5S-FTE setup and will have room to grow on.

[Cisco93lude]

Manny!!! hows it goin man!! cant wait for the meets this year... me n justin met some kids from school who live in NJ so we should be goin to DWG this year. My car should be finished soon and justin just bought a new turbo and were gonna get his car running better. CANT Wait!!! ne new plans for this year for ur ride??

[presure2]

Just use the 3S-GTE manifold for now [it's good for way more HP than your gonna run anyway] with a CT-26 to *your intended turbo* adapter. It's dependable, made for your car [kind of] and cheap/easy to find.
In fact, if it was me, I'd run as many 3S stock components as possible [with the exception of fuel injectors (which won't even fit), fuel pump etc.] for my initial setup/tuning process. The CT-26 or a rebuilt variation [like Manny has - CT-27 from ATS etc.] is perfect for the beginner 5S-FTE setup and will have room to grow on.

i would agree with that, especially for someone just learning the basics of turbos in general.
when your learning, IMO the K.I.S.S. method works best 99% of the time.
Keep
It
Simple
Stupid!!
at least thats what my old man always told me!! haha.

as far as "plans" the only thing i'd really like to do to jenns car this year is cams.
cams will totally change the way the 5sfte feels, and performs, especially on the track.

[6strngs]

Just use the 3S-GTE manifold for now [it's good for way more HP than your gonna run anyway] with a CT-26 to *your intended turbo* adapter. It's dependable, made for your car [kind of] and cheap/easy to find.
In fact, if it was me, I'd run as many 3S stock components as possible [with the exception of fuel injectors (which won't even fit), fuel pump etc.] for my initial setup/tuning process. The CT-26 or a rebuilt variation [like Manny has - CT-27 from ATS etc.] is perfect for the beginner 5S-FTE setup and will have room to grow on.

i would agree with that, especially for someone just learning the basics of turbos in general.
when your learning, IMO the K.I.S.S. method works best 99% of the time.
Keep
It
Simple
Stupid!!
at least thats what my old man always told me!! haha.

as far as "plans" the only thing i'd really like to do to jenns car this year is cams.
cams will totally change the way the 5sfte feels, and performs, especially on the track.

what kind of difference in horsepower and 1/4 mile times do you think cams would do for a 5sfte. You ran like a 14.0 without them right? so, maybe in the low 13 seconds?

[presure2]

Just use the 3S-GTE manifold for now [it's good for way more HP than your gonna run anyway] with a CT-26 to *your intended turbo* adapter. It's dependable, made for your car [kind of] and cheap/easy to find.
In fact, if it was me, I'd run as many 3S stock components as possible [with the exception of fuel injectors (which won't even fit), fuel pump etc.] for my initial setup/tuning process. The CT-26 or a rebuilt variation [like Manny has - CT-27 from ATS etc.] is perfect for the beginner 5S-FTE setup and will have room to grow on.

i would agree with that, especially for someone just learning the basics of turbos in general.
when your learning, IMO the K.I.S.S. method works best 99% of the time.
Keep
It
Simple
Stupid!!
at least thats what my old man always told me!! haha.

as far as "plans" the only thing i'd really like to do to jenns car this year is cams.
cams will totally change the way the 5sfte feels, and performs, especially on the track.

what kind of difference in horsepower and 1/4 mile times do you think cams would do for a 5sfte. You ran like a 14.0 without them right? so, maybe in the low 13 seconds?

ive never gotten a good launch in the car. the 14.1 i ran last year hitting boost cut was a 105mhp trap speed which should normally be good for a solid mid 13's r(13.5-13.8) run. (mr2 guys run 13.2-13.4 @ 105mph)
i cant say for sure, but i would "expect" at least ~20whp and ftlbs, even with a mild cam like dustin is running, with 95% of the gains above 4400rpm, which again IMO would make the car a SOLID mid 13's car.
the way the 5sfte falls on it face after 5k really hurts in the 1/4.

[bseaman_5]

oops

This post has been edited by bseaman_5: Apr 10, 2008 - 10:46 PM

[conv95celica]

so i got the best end of the shaft on this one. i stopped the payment so they didnt get the money but they accidentally sent the turbo to me. hah not that i can really use it still thought u guys would get a kick outa it.

[6strngs]

so i got the best end of the shaft on this one. i stopped the payment so they didnt get the money but they accidentally sent the turbo to me. hah not that i can really use it still thought u guys would get a kick outa it.

I'd either send it back or send them the money or else they're not gonna be very happy.....

[presure2]

WOOOOOOOOOT
3 years, 40,000+ miles, zero failures.

i think we can now say, officially, that built right, the 5sfe is a viable turbo platform

funny story...
we had the annual "CSP" meet last month, and lots of new people showed up...i happened to walk over to the car, and walked into a coversation between 3 kids.

one wispered over to the other "it'll definetly blow up..."

i walked up and said, "dude, this is going on 3 years, 40,000 miles..it isnt just gonna "blow up", if its gonna pop, its cause i MAKE it."
"ohh wow...3 years huh, nothing broken?"
"no, zero failiures to date..i am the 5sfte king"

needless to say, they didnt have much to say about it after that.

i've been running denatured alcohol (AKA methanol) in my WI kit, with good results, i need to setup the map clamp on the emanage ultimate so i can run more than 16psi, and get a good tune for it worked up (my laptop took a crap)

cams will be getting installed in the next couple months as well.

ohh, and rebuilt turbos DO last, like everything else in this project, provided they are done right.

[jcaron9gt4]

Congrats Manny. And yes, you are the 5sfte king lol. I can't wait to see what kind of results your going to get with those cams. I know once you get them and post up some numbers, thats going to be a must for everybody once they turbo their 5's.