Body Roll, FWD Roll Options

[CrazyJ]

After reading the now closed "body roll" topic I just want to add that I can make my 94 SSII JDM 2.0 Celica (3sge) drift around a round-a-bout (these simplify big junctions in the uk)...

I was doing about 20mph driving like miss daisy in third gear barely touching the acceleration and my back end came right out whilst on a 2/3 lock of the wheel to the right.... It came out so bad I drifted the last 1/3 of the round-a-bout off to my exit... very cool and extremely scary....any doubters and I will take you for a spin myself (if you live near of course) and er prove it...

Any I was defo driving carefully because the missis was in the car...

I have had the front shocks changed and the anti roll bar bushes since, also waiting for the cv joints to be changed,.. I can still make it do it but have to work harder now.

just for the record.

Cheers

J

[Kwanza26]

why are you even brining back this subject? Some people just aren't very smart. I don't even wanna start. It's like talking to a brick wall sometimes. Even if I can explain with perfect clearity... if people wanna be badass drifters with FWD cars... they're gonna be... and there's no changing that. I raced a 94 Celica for 3 years from when I was 15-18 and I've NEVER had any "verycool tail sliding" scenarios... but then again... I also drive FR cars (87 RX7 back in the day and currently AE86 Corollas) so I know the difference.

As for your explaination... if you're gonna tell me you're "drifting" at 20mph in 3rd gear... heh... heh... ok buddy. Whatever you say. You know... Mid engine cars have trouble doing that in the wet...

[playr158]

ha ha kwanza.......
ok since your mostly a noob and not that into your car.....

sway bars (suspension tech)
coilovers (GC, arospeed, TEIN)
shocks(KONI, KYB)
strut tower bars(DG.TOYOTA.dodgeneon)

[CrazyJ]

Dude, its not my intention to bring it back up. Simply to let others know I have had the experience. I'm not doubting your experience either but just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

It could be any number of things on my car that caused it. No doubt something is broken that caused it (im pretty sure the car was used for rally track days prior to me getting it).

And as for my terminology,.. who cares,. skidding sliding drifting loose tail. Either way the car was at a harsh angle not usually driven at whilst doing 20mph. Im not stupid I know thats not right. But it happened.

So thanks for the VERY helpful reply.

Jase

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

http://www.tuner-world.com/drivetips_6.html

[playr158]

lol if your car was used for RALLY then you'd OBVIOUSLY have better suspension ect... that would not let you do the slide at 20

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

Could happen if he hit a pach of gravel, dirt, or something. I understand that some poeple will post BS, but I think it's important to give poeple the beifit of the doubt. Can't we all just get along?

[Kwanza26]

Could happen if he hit a pach of gravel, dirt, or something.  I understand that some poeple will post BS, but I think it's important to give poeple the beifit of the doubt.  Can't we all just get along?
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Benefit of the doubt is given if it makes sense. 20mph drift in 3rd gear doesn't make sense in any car...

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

Could happen if he hit a pach of gravel, dirt, or something.  I understand that some poeple will post BS, but I think it's important to give poeple the beifit of the doubt.  Can't we all just get along?
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Benefit of the doubt is given if it makes sense. 20mph drift in 3rd gear doesn't make sense in any car...
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Why you hatin?

[Kwanza26]

Why you hatin?  
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I don't hate... I'm just annoyed by people trying to follow the new trends and go "drifting" in their FWD cars... I help run a shop so I get it constantly...

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

Drifting is still the "in thing?" I thought that fad played its coarse aready. Shoot, I love the stuff, I had a 88 RX-7 that I dirt raced and sometimes drifted(non-event). As long as it's all in good fun. This fad will be over just as quick and the aluminum wing craze, so try to relax about man. Your getting to worked up over a few ingorant poeple. Poeple like that haven't loved cars their intire lives, and won't forever. There just not real car poeple, which means they don't matter.

[Kwanza26]

Drifting is still the "in thing?"  I thought that fad played its coarse aready. Shoot, I love the stuff, I had a 88 RX-7 that I dirt raced and sometimes drifted(non-event).  As long as it's all in good fun.  This fad will be over just as quick and the aluminum wing craze, so try to relax about man.  Your getting to worked up over a few ingorant poeple.  Poeple like that haven't loved cars their intire lives, and won't forever.  There just not real car poeple, which means they don't matter.
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It's not that I get pissed or anything like that. Typically it all starts with me saying something as simple as "FWD cars don't tail slide like that" and then it blows up from there. This topic however was a blatant and stupid attempt to carry on an argument that obviously pissed off a quite a few people on both ends, hence it was locked. It's not neccesary and I don't even want to waste my time to explain to the person who started this topic. That's all.

As for drifting... I dunno how it is where you live... but drifting is only gonna get bigger. I deal with performance imports and so-called "drifter cars" are beginning to replace the common FF import. Also notice import magazines now cover the popular drift cars (240sx, etc) as much as they cover the typical Honda. It's growing. I personally think drifting is a fun thing to do and requires very high driving skill levels, however is still not a proven race technique (on pavement anyway). The sad thing is, most of the so-called tail sliding people still drive FF cars or have very poor FR driving skills. When people don't know enough how different drivetrain layouts react... it's just annoying to hear them claim things such as tail sliding around a corner and drifting at 20 mph in 3rd gear with an FF car, which typically don't react like that.

[RedSunCelica]

are you sure the back end was sliding and not the front end? kinda hard to believe that the back end will do that in 3rd at 20mph.

even in heavy rain it wont happen. im pretty sure you where understeering thru the corner steering got light and it felt like you where drifting. either way i say we have a 6gc track day at willow springs race way whos with me

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

I'm for it. I'd like to see how I race on pavement. I'm probably not that good, but it's all about having a good time. I've wanted to take my car to the track even before I had it. Anyone know any good tracks in WV? I'm going to post that as a new topic in general, so don't feel obligated to answer it here.

[playr158]

ok if i remember correctly the RPM at 20 mph in 3rd is like ummm under 2000?

WHO THE HELL CAN SPIN A TIRE AT 2000RPM iN a 6th GEN celi?!?!?!?!?!

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

Come on guys, let him alone. He obviously doesn't have all his facts in line, but he could just be mistaken on a few things instead of intentionally lying to us. I no his story doesn't make since, but he is new to this site. He joined dec6 of 2004. I know that’s no excuse, but because he's so new to the site, it makes me think that he's probably pretty young. And I think we can all remember a time when we were young and..... well...not as with it (sorry CrazyJ).

[CrazyJ]

Some interesting facts in those replies. It could of potentially been the front wheels sliding then the back just followed. But the first time it happened the rear did come out (since then I have had the rear toe and thrust line corrected).

Bulldog, thought it may have been oil, gravel or something on the road, but before I had the adjustments it did it on any road (if it was atleast damp and it was a right turn).

I tried to recreate the problem the other day and again at quite a low speed again far right exit on a different roundabout it seemed the road turned to glass, because I was expecting this it was corrected quickly but the back end did NOT come out this time the whole car just slid. So I guess that was the rear toe.

This has only happened when turning right, and its nothing to do with speed, its to do with how far I turn the wheel. It seems a lot easier to turn to the right, than to the left. And when turning to the left I have really pushed it and she sticks like glue.

I'm not trying to pi$$ anyone off btw, this is for mine and my familys safety in the car, nothing to do with anyones sanity...

Oh and dont doubt my love for the car please. (she might hear you).

Jase

[doGGy]

here goes my story...

At first then i bought my celica (compleatly stock, on stock 15 steeles), i almost crashed it like 3 times, and this was just becose my tail was sliding so bad, that i didnt knew what to do... It wasnt drifting, but the tail of my car was so light, that after few sharp turns of the wheel on gravel i could drift to the outside of the corner so easy not even using my handbrake... same happend on normal roads.. few times i came to sharp to the corner and tail just slided, leaving my car at 35' angle in the corner... it was no fun at all, i was just sceard cuz of not being able to control then my there my car gonna go control... In winter it was fun, cuz i ould drift (yes kwanza DRIFT ) any corners i wanted without handbrake...just few sharp turns of the steering wheel, and tail just slided easily...

It all ended then i lowered my car, and put the 225/45 on... from what day, i can do crazy speed corners without been sceard of my tail sliding away... only thing that im sceard what my front or whole car will lose grip and i will end up at safty bariers...

[Kwanza26]

here goes my story...

At first then i bought my celica (compleatly stock, on stock 15 steeles),  i almost crashed it like 3 times, and this was just becose my tail was sliding so bad, that i didnt knew what to do... It wasnt drifting, but the tail of my car was so light, that after few sharp turns of the wheel on gravel i could drift to the outside of the corner so easy not even using my handbrake... same happend on normal roads.. few times i came to sharp to the corner and tail just slided, leaving my car at 35' angle in the corner... it was no fun at all, i was just sceard cuz of not being able to control then my there my car gonna go control... In winter it was fun, cuz i ould drift (yes kwanza DRIFT ) any corners i wanted without handbrake...just few sharp turns of the steering wheel, and tail just slided easily...

It all ended then i lowered my car, and put the 225/45 on... from what day, i can do crazy speed corners without been sceard of my tail sliding away... only thing that im sceard what my front or whole car will lose grip and i will end up at safty bariers...
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I just keep repeating the same sh!t over and over so it's becoming pointless. I've driven cars to the brink and even destroyed one and I assure you, getting the tail to slide is not an easy task. Dry pavement makes it a completely different game (I've said this I don't know how many times)... snow is easy, gravel and dirt is easy because you don't have to set on the gas to continue the slide. You can tap it. Pavement, well, any attempts at major throttle control will cause the front to increase grip and understeer. No throttle control will cause loss of speed and result in grip (spin-out of understeer). *Sigh*... I need to get on a track and demonstrate. That'll be the only way you people can know the differences...

[pimpstarr690]

Dude...simple just slap some coil over's and front n' rear srut bars....slam your car to the ground...I slammed mine 4 inches but no aftermarket srut bars...Dropping it really improves the handling...taking corner's at higher speeds....mmmm lol =)

~doggy...good luck with your drifting...i bet you'll slam into something because when you turn...that's if you turn you'll just slide....The lil blizzard thing we just had the other day in Ohio I went to turn but turning was not an option...I found it very usefull to drift every turn so that I could make it completely...

This post has been edited by pimpstarr690: Dec 15, 2004 - 3:11 PM