Smaay ! V6 vs. Beams, Let's do this ! Options

[Batman722]

OK, there has been debates left and right about this.
You're a big believer in you're V6, and you should be.
I'm a believer in both.

First, I have respect for a good V6. The 1mz-fe isn't the best IMO, a 3mz-fe is better IMO.
A power of a 1mz-fe comparable to a Beams all day. The power delivery and torque curve is very different, yes but you can never compare a GE head to an FE head.
You have a 1mz/3mz hybrid, that's like saying a hybrid 5s-gte is better than a stock 3sgte.

I have a Beams in my Celica. Bone stock (except an exhaust) with the LSD tranny it came with.
The Beams is great down low and booms after 4K rpms and pulls hard until red line, the advantage of VVT-I with a GE head.

Ease of swap ? Beams in a heartbeat.
The Beams is close to plug and play, you can use a s54 or use the s54 w/lsd with the motor with no custom mounts, no custom anything really.
Reliability ? Beams. Any V6 (1m or 3m) should be rebuilt. You'd be a fool not to, we all know why.
Parts availability ? Both. Beams parts are available in the US. There is virtually no part I couldn't get from another toyota that's used on a Beams.
Power ? 1mz-fe or Beams ? IMO Beams. I have driven the 1m in a Camry, I'm sure it would be more fun in a Celica, until someone proves me wrong the Beams is my answer.
3mz-fe ? all day over a Beams, but cost is much higher.
Cost of swap (1mz-fe) ? Beams is less a landslide. Why ? Well...a 1m motor is cheaper but it gonna need a rebuild - no doubt (always do a compression test first). Most people can't rebuild an engine ($), you should use an e153 with hybrid axles, a custom mount (don't you sell one for around $200 ?), the wiring - for an average person, it's gonna cost them to have someone do it, how about the power steering pump, AC, throttle cable, ect. The Beams is a Celica motor going into a Celica. The only difficult part is wiring, which is piss easy for an average person. There is no custom anything, except maybe a tach adapter or use a stock Beams cluster and no adapter needed.

Overall I would (and did) put a Beams in a Celica over a 1mz-fe.
A 3mz-fe would be better but I don't like the drive by wire set up, problems will arise.
A 2gr would be overkill and would kill our 15-19 year old cars.

[Box]

All things being equal I put my money of the V6. The thing with the FTO though is despite being a V6 it makes less torque than the 5S does. The 1MZ on the other hand makes over 200 ft lbs. Even with the Solara weighing in at some 3,250 pounds it'll hit 60 in 7.1 seconds. So imagine shaving off some 600-700 pounds off of that. It's still easier to get any part for the 1MZ though, no cross referencing and what not just find parts for a Camry and done. I don't see why you insist the 1MZ needs a rebuild though. Within my family alone there have been over 10 1MZ's most with over 200K miles on them with no problems whatsoever on the original engine. Yes yes the sludge problem, but that's only a problem if it was neglected. Besides, it's worth going 1MZ for the sole fact it won't sound like a bumble bee with gas.

[Smaay]

All things being equal I put my money of the V6. The thing with the FTO though is despite being a V6 it makes less torque than the 5S does. The 1MZ on the other hand makes over 200 ft lbs. Even with the Solara weighing in at some 3,250 pounds it'll hit 60 in 7.1 seconds. So imagine shaving off some 600-700 pounds off of that. It's still easier to get any part for the 1MZ though, no cross referencing and what not just find parts for a Camry and done. I don't see why you insist the 1MZ needs a rebuild though. Within my family alone there have been over 10 1MZ's most with over 200K miles on them with no problems whatsoever on the original engine. Yes yes the sludge problem, but that's only a problem if it was neglected. Besides, it's worth going 1MZ for the sole fact it won't sound like a bumble bee with gas.

this is all correct. I have never seen any correlation that a 1MZ sludges any more than any other engine. Lack of maintenance is all placed on the owner, you cant blame the engine for that. Its amazing how many people just put gas in and go. they never bother with anything else.



here is my dyno again. im making 215 ft lbs of TQ at 2500 RPMs.


you will never see results like that in a 4 banger N/A and i even doubt it boosted.

[Box]

here is my dyno again. im making 215 ft lbs of TQ at 2500 RPMs.


you will never see results like that in a 4 banger N/A and i even doubt it boosted.

The Saab Viggen made 252 ft lb at 2,500 RPM with a turbo 2.3 I4. That's about the only one the comes to mind at the moment though.

This post has been edited by Box: Sep 25, 2013 - 3:03 PM