Looking for Expert Opinions, What would you pay for this car, assuming you WANTED to buy it. Options

[Langing]

1997 ST Limited Edition Celica Liftback 5-speed 1.8L L4 engine. . . ABS, Alloy Wheels, Leather Seats. . . Very Clean. . . approx. 100k miles.

Photos show both the outside and inside were well kept and in very good condition. They are asking $5.5K!

What's the maximum you would offer for this vehicle?

[VavAlephVav]

http://www.kbb.com/toyota/celica/1997-toyo...ition=very-good

Kelly blue book says $2500 from a person $3200 from a dealer. (but that changes slightly depending on your location) from there it's a matter of how well maintained it has been. have the struts and mounts been replaced? does the motor need any work? has it ever had a head gasket? do they actually do sheet like flush all the brake fluid every 5 years?
open the radiator and look at the coolant and check the radiator cap/overflow tube for gunk.
don't be too fooled by a pretty looking paint job. anytime you buy a used car you're probably going to spend another couple thousand dollars fixing some things unless you buy it from somebody who was real good about maintenance and fixing things.

I wouldn't give somebody much more than what KBB says unless they've done lots of repair work to it

This post has been edited by VavAlephVav: Aug 1, 2014 - 12:56 PM

[Langing]

http://www.kbb.com/toyota/celica/1997-toyo...ition=very-good

Kelly blue book says $2500 from a person $3200 from a dealer. (but that changes slightly depending on your location) from there it's a matter of how well maintained it has been. have the struts and mounts been replaced? does the motor need any work? has it ever had a head gasket? do they actually do sheet like flush all the brake fluid every 5 years?
open the radiator and look at the coolant and check the radiator cap/overflow tube for gunk.
don't be too fooled by a pretty looking paint job. anytime you buy a used car you're probably going to spend another couple thousand dollars fixing some things unless you buy it from somebody who was real good about maintenance and fixing things.

I wouldn't give somebody much more than what KBB says unless they've done lots of repair work to it

Right, one way to approach making an offer to buy such a car is to begin with the Kelly Blue Book valuation.

The car is being sold by a dealer, so the KBB 'dealer' value for this car, in VERY GOOD condition, is $3,200. So, it should be priced by this dealer close to $3,200. The error variance of that number must be something like a couple hundred dollars, plus or minus, so actually there would be a range of values, something like $3,000 to $3,400, statistically based on what many people have paid for the same car in the same condition category.

That's more than $2,000 less that the dealer's listed price of about $5,500!

Until you brought it up, I hadn't considered the weight I should place on a car's value due to the quality of its maintenance, but now it seems obvious, as high quality maintenance represents sunk costs expended by the owner, costs I would not have to bear in the near future if the owner had done his best regarding maintenance. For example, if the owner had replaced the timing belt, all the struts, all the wheel bearings, all the suspension bushings, all the motor mounts, and on and on, when checking wear items as the maintenance schedule recommends, he would have added a lot of (what I consider hidden) value to the car.

Said the other way around, his quality of maintenance would likely have saved me a lot of money, money that I wouldn't have to shell out just after buying the car. It's just like you said, "anytime you buy a used car you're probably going to spend another couple thousand dollars fixing some things unless you buy it from somebody who was real good about maintenance and fixing things." And that couple thousand is my bargaining room, if I happened to have the actual maintenance information.

Say his maintenance quality was perfect, suggesting my expenses after purchase were zero, then the price range, based on KBB, might be reasonably extended to $5,000 to $5,400, because the owner already paid that extra couple thousand and now it is part of the car's actual value, just as improvements add to the value of a house. NOTE WELL: That is only true if his maintenance quality was perfect, and we live in the real world!

Since it's a dealer, maintenance information might be hard to come by! I could only look for evidence the car had been well maintained. To be totally fair I should be given the car's actual maintenance history, so I could know what deferred maintenance costs were ahead of me.

Is there some good reason, legal or otherwise, not to contact the previous owner?

VERY GOOD CONDITION seems a subjective evaluation that is probably based on someone looking at the car, its outside, its inside, its engine compartment, its wheels, and not much more. I'm sure there are plenty of car owners who keep their vehicles washed, waxed, and very clean inside, but don't take mechanical maintenance all that seriously. Thus, I would guess that KBB does not take maintenance into consideration, except as a byproduct of the fact that when a car appraises in the VERY GOOD CONDITION category it raises the probability that the owner was taking mechanical maintenance seriously.