I am just going to run low boost. . . yea right!, A warning for anyone who wants to boost a 5sfe Options

[HardHead93]

This is a cautionary tale to anyone who thinks they are going to slap a turbo on a high mileage engine and run low boost. DON’T DO IT! In December of 2014 despite all the posts that say, don’t boost your engine unless it is low mileage or rebuilt, I went for it. Is the 5sfe a great engine to boost, yes, but do it right. This post will tell the LONG, expensive, frustrating story to creating my 5sfte. The below write up is what happened.

Background
It has been a long road for this 5sfte build. Here is the engine I started with:


I saw what Supershannon77 did with an Ebay T3/4 turbo for her 6th gen Celica 5sfte and I tried to duplicate it (with a few upgrades). I bought an Ebay kit with the idea that I would need to modify or replace some of the parts that came in it but the bottom line was it would give me a turbo, intercooler, exhaust manifold, downpipe, and some miscellaneous needed parts.

As I started the build I found the kit seriously lacking. The big one was the downpipe was for a CT26 turbo not a T3/4 so I had to order one. There was no oil return line and there was not enough intercooler piping. It took 3 months to resolve all the issues with the advertised “bolt-on” kit (there is no such thing as bolt on from Ebay), I ended up with the following build:


8 psi boost
T3/T04E Turbo
Turbosmart Wastegate
2.5 inch full exhaust
Magnaflow Muffler and Catalytic Converter
AEM FIC Piggyback
SSQV Blow Off Valve
460cc RX-7 Injectors
FMIC
Walpro 255 Fuel Pump
3sgte 3 Bar MAP Sensor
Custom downpipe from Demon Motorsports
Ebay tubular exhaust manifold

I started noticing when I would pop the hood after a drive that there was an extreme amount of heat coming out of the engine bay. I also saw that the under hood insulation was burning away. After doing some digging, I found that the tubular manifold I was using was giving off too much heat instead of shooting it down to the exhaust. I needed a 3sgte manifold. I went to the Toyota dealership and they told me that all their warehouses are out of stock and that the best bet was to find a used one. That led to one option, Ebay. After about a week of missing out on bids I finally scored a 3sgte manifold. It arrived and I was so excited, I ceramic coated it and put it on and the car was back!


Then another problem reared its head, the clutch started slipping. I bought a SPEC stage 2 clutch, got it installed and the car ran like a champ. In the process of tuning the car, I sprung a fuel leak that lead to an engine fire. I think it the Walpro fuel pump put too much pressure on the original lines coming from the fuel filter and something popped.




Now here I am, where I should have started. In hindsight I should have rebuilt the engine before going down the turbo route. My plan was to fix the fire damage and rebuild the engine to a 14-15 psi boost-able monster. My goal is 280-300 horsepower. Based on what I saw in Pressure2’s build, I can use stock pistons and rods but I will need a metal head gasket. I planned to swap the California cylinder head with a Federal head so the fuel injectors fit perfectly.

[enderswift]

It's really hard to kill a 3SGTE. They can take a beating all day long in triple digit heat without issue. I boost 20+ psi on my 3rd gen and bang through the gears at 7k on my commute to work. I've been doing this for the past 40k....These engines are STRONG

In my opinion your engine was knocking and you didn't realize it. The reason I say this is because a common symptom of knock is rising coolant temps. knock breaks through the thin insulating film in the combustion chamber and exposes the cylinders to the full heat combustion, thus raising temps.Don't believe such an insulating film exists? ask yourself how an aluminum piston doesn't melt during normal driving...

Also the stock cooling setup can handle the 3sgte no problem. So considering you replaced everything and yet the temps still rose, I'd say knock was dumping heat into the system. Knock also puts crank and connecting rod bearings through hell, leading to similar damage to oil starvation.

It look like you know what you're doing, and I'm not insulting the quality of your build. I just want to convey that knock can be sneaky and lead to a situation like this.

I think I got a bad 4th gen 3sgte (bad head gasket and worn piston rings). I was only running 14 psi and when the car started overheating and knocking. I wasn't in boost and I have put a total of 1000k miles on this motor since the swap (did my first oil change at 500 miles to make sure any crap that had settled in the motor was out)

Only a compression test, leakdown test, or hydrocarbon test can confirm whether your head gasket/rings are shot. Thing is, a knocking engine can absolutely cause both of these as well.

Anyway, I only raise boost with the proper supporting mods in place. Colder plugs and water injection are good for staving off knock into the low 20 psi range. A handful of other guys on here will agree. Consider doing the same if you get a replacement engine

Good luck

This post has been edited by enderswift: Jan 1, 2017 - 3:01 PM

[HardHead93]

Thanks for the information. I am wondering what was causing the knock. I have been running colder NGK BKR7E plugs and I was having heat issues even when the engine was set at 7 psi before I ran a boost controller. Like you said, it is hard to kill a 3sgte, and with me taking it a lightly as a did for these initial miles, I am really thinking I was sold an engine that was not well taken care of by the previous owner. Most people run 16 psi with no problems on these engines with the exact set up I have. I read that the PRIMEMR2 guys run into this occasionally where they get a 4th gen that is either dead or dying. Just my bad luck.

I know hindsight is 20/20 but I really wish I would have took the cylinder head off and inspected the pistons and bearings with a little more detail. Sure it would have cost me at a minimum a head gasket but it would have given me piece of mind. Looking back I did notice a dark yellowish/orange tint to the cams and cylinder head under the valve cover. That is a telling sign of a higher mileage or abused engine, maybe over 60K miles like advertised to me. Also, now that I think about it, the highest Octane around here is 91, could that have caused the knock problem? It may be something other than the gas because I was having heat issues at 7 psi. Like I said in the previous post, I was having some large amounts of oil in the blow by even while not on boost, is that normal?

I am really hoping when I pull the engine that there is not too much scaring on the crankshaft so I can get it machined. I am definitely leaning towards rebuilding the motor with forged rods and pistons. Even if I get another motor because I cannot save this one, I am going to rebuild it with forged internals before I put it in. I am not going to sit back and hope my next JDM motor was treated well before it was handed to me. But who knows, I am still not against selling the car and getting another project down the road.

This post has been edited by HardHead93: Jan 1, 2017 - 5:19 PM