6G Celicas Forums

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

> "Airflow and How it Makes Ponies" Theory, Someone help me out.
post Aug 15, 2007 - 10:10 AM
+Quote Post
FortuneCookie



Enthusiast
**
Joined Dec 12, '06
From Fob Sharana, Afghanistan
Currently Offline

Reputation: 2 (100%)




Alright guys. I've been looking into intake induction for a while now. I've probably changed out my intake design probably 5 times already just to try to get better gains. I was thinking about getting cold-air intake next since I have a short-ram intake. BUT, as I was thinking, something hit me and it got me questioning really good. As people keep talking about intake, they talk about airflow and how it gives more horsepower by more airflow into the chamber. And ofcourse, more air means more fuel needed. But something else hit me hard. I've changed my intake system a couple times already and all of them felt different in responce. Not majorly but you can tell (it's ur car, you would know). Intake isn't about how much air is going in. Now that I think of it, it's about vacuum! It's not air getting pushed in, it's air getting pulled in. So I questioned to myself, how do I increase the vacuum velocity so that I can get some better gain than what I have now. Well I did some quick research. Apparently, it's all physics. kindasad.gif Something that I'm not good at. But my uncle majored in Quantum Physics in college. So I asked him, "Hey, do you know anything about vacuum and velocity for airflow?" And he said, "Yeah. What for?" I said, "I'm trying to figure out how to make air sucked in faster into the my engine without having to spend a big butchet." And he said, "The smaller the pipe, the more vacuum you'll create." And I paused. I said to myself, wait a minute, most of the time, bigger is better when it comes to cars. Like for instance, the bigger the tubing, the more space it would have to channel air to be vacuumed. But it would not create faster vacuum or would it? Not sure but I decided to do more research. And it turns out, that constriction (snake swirl) type tubing actually helps vacuum velocity increase. Not only that but if you have a constriction figure at the both ends or in the middle of a tube, velocity speed increases and also less pressure. I'm stealing these methods from G. B. Venturi who died 1822 as a Italian physicist. http://biyografi.info/kelime/venturi So I figured, how come no ones ever really thought about this? This would actually evolutionize intake tubing design. What do you guys think? Am I onto something?

This post has been edited by FortuneCookie: Aug 15, 2007 - 10:35 AM
 
Start new topic
Replies
post Aug 15, 2007 - 11:39 AM
+Quote Post
Gary



Enthusiast
***
Joined Aug 28, '04
From FLA USA
Currently Offline

Reputation: 4 (100%)




In venturi shape pipe, air moves faster through the smaller section and pressure drops (vacuum gains) in order to maintain its energy (Bernoulli's theorem of conservation of energy) However, flow rate will remain constant due to change in cross sectional area. It is true that when you reduce the intake diameter, air will move faster through it. However, you will never surpass amount of vacuum causing by pistons moving down. If your intake is smaller than the TB, you are creating restriction, period.

Try squeezing your nose and tell me if your can breath better.
Or look at this way, after running, you are tired and need more air, you start breathing through your mouth. Why?
You need more oxygen going in and you are getting rid of CO2.
Both at a higher (flow) rate than usual.
Your nose is too restrictive for large amount of air being sucked/pushed to/from your lungs.

Larger = less restrictive
For the intake pipe before TB, larger is ALWAYS better.


--------------------
_Gary
IPB Image
post Aug 15, 2007 - 11:52 AM
+Quote Post
FortuneCookie



Enthusiast
**
Joined Dec 12, '06
From Fob Sharana, Afghanistan
Currently Offline

Reputation: 2 (100%)




QUOTE(Gary @ Aug 15, 2007 - 12:39 PM) [snapback]588149[/snapback]

In venturi shape pipe, air moves faster through the smaller section and pressure drops (vacuum gains) in order to maintain its energy (Bernoulli's theorem of conservation of energy) However, flow rate will remain constant due to change in cross sectional area. It is true that when you reduce the intake diameter, air will move faster through it. However, you will never surpass amount of vacuum causing by pistons moving down. If your intake is smaller than the TB, you are creating restriction, period.

Try squeezing your nose and tell me if your can breath better.
Or look at this way, after running, you are tired and need more air, you start breathing through your mouth. Why?
You need more oxygen going in and you are getting rid of CO2.
Both at a higher (flow) rate than usual.
Your nose is too restrictive for large amount of air being sucked/pushed to/from your lungs.

Larger = less restrictive
For the intake pipe before TB, larger is ALWAYS better.


Nice nice. So ofcourse, vacuum will be much faster with a smaller diameter piping, but only through the piping area as so it seems. So bigger is better on the diameter. But what about the constrictive (snake swirl aka helix) design? Supposably that will cause vacuum to increase as well. Maybe not much gains but definately should improve engine responce. I wanna make sure that what I'm testing will be worth testing becuz I've already researched and it'll probably be about a $300-$400 experiment.

Posts in this topic
- FortuneCookie   "Airflow and How it Makes Ponies" Theory   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:10 AM
- - Redline08   tornado, the $60 "turbo" is what yo...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:23 AM
|- - FortuneCookie   QUOTE(Redline08 @ Aug 15, 2007 - 11...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:28 AM
- - lagos   more restriction will create more vacuum, but tha...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:25 AM
- - x_itchy_b_x   because how much air an engine can ingest isn...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:25 AM
- - ecaddiction   I like that straw analogy. Think of it the other w...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:33 AM
|- - FortuneCookie   QUOTE(ecaddiction @ Aug 15, 2007 - 11...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:34 AM
- - ecaddiction   It will be interesting to hear the results...   Aug 15, 2007 - 10:42 AM
- - Gary   In venturi shape pipe, air moves faster through th...   Aug 15, 2007 - 11:39 AM
|- - FortuneCookie   QUOTE(Gary @ Aug 15, 2007 - 12:39 PM...   Aug 15, 2007 - 11:52 AM
- - FortuneCookie   You know what guys. I did more research, turns out...   Aug 15, 2007 - 12:09 PM
- - Redline08   thats cool lol watever, intake doesnt even give y...   Aug 15, 2007 - 6:16 PM
- - cheeco   QUOTENow that I think of it, it's about vacuum...   Aug 16, 2007 - 5:26 PM
|- - azian_advanced   QUOTE(cheeco @ Aug 16, 2007 - 5:26 P...   Aug 16, 2007 - 10:07 PM
|- - 3s-gte_man   QUOTE(cheeco @ Aug 16, 2007 - 5:26 P...   Aug 19, 2007 - 6:26 AM
- - K-ESD   think about ACIS (acoustic induction control) the ...   Aug 16, 2007 - 9:02 PM
- - Shocker   It wont do anything for you..It will probaly creat...   Aug 16, 2007 - 9:23 PM
- - xs94st   QUOTEyou can try all sorts of sizes for piping and...   Aug 17, 2007 - 1:08 AM
- - bindertch   Everything depends on your head design and your in...   Aug 20, 2007 - 10:13 PM
- - mrgrape   im gonna steal ur idea and make millions lol   Aug 20, 2007 - 10:35 PM


Reply to this topicStart new topic
7 User(s) are reading this topic (7 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Lo-Fi Version Time is now: February 20th, 2025 - 12:00 PM