8-inch door speakers Options

[pepsiman]

I was thinking about putting some 8-inch subs in my doors but i just read that it will rattle the doors real bad...what can i do to prevent this? I have never opened up the guts of my door can u put plenty of sound deading in there? Will that stop the rattles? Also does the subs in the door have to be shallow mount to fit? What is a good 8 inch sub? pionneer has no 8's on their site but primeir does but they are alittle pricey for me i dont need anything crazy just wantin to add some bass but it dont have to be crazy

[soven]

Look into speakers instead of subs. as for rattles. if it is door rods, either wrap them in foam or use rubber bands perpendicular to movement.

sound deadening..... separated to outer skin and inner skin. outer skin is the surface where your car exterior is while inner trim is where the speaker mounts onto.

Use sound deadening on the outer skin to reduce panel flexing, vibration.

use sound deadening on the inner skin to slow down the backwave of the speaker from interfering with the front.(better bass,clarity etc) and also for road noise.

Get Dynamat extreme if budget allows.

anyway, good option is just to get a 4 channel amp. A set of front 2way component set. add in a sub in future.

edit./ therefore.... you can fit any speaker upto 8inch in size with 80mm~depth(with a mdf spacer). if you had a 6.5" speaker, you just need to make spacers. I did a bit of a writeup a while ago, should be able to search it.

This post has been edited by soven: Feb 6, 2007 - 10:28 PM

[pepsiman]

thanks for the reply...i thought there was a how to on how to put subs into your doors the reason i was considering this is i already got 6x9s in my trunk and i didnt want to throw another box back there and have all this stuff then i thought of that how-to about putting them in your door so i figured that was for me cause I was wanting to add a sub or 2 plus a amp but i wont be doin this for a while i need more money and i want to do it right with a good amp and wiring so has anyone put a sub under the front seats? I think ive read bout that somewhere but i wanting opinons would it be muffeled?

[jess_i_74]

Bass waves tend not to be very directional below a certain point (might be as high as 500hz? can't remember). Anyways, it's just like a sub in the hatch; it has to go through a couple seats to get to you, but the waves are so big (and actually vibrate the car) that it doesn't matter.

[azian_advanced]

Look into speakers instead of subs. as for rattles. if it is door rods, either wrap them in foam or use rubber bands perpendicular to movement.

i have major rattle problems with my sub in my door... i've been too busy to get around it but it seems the little white round plastic piece joining the two rods for the handle or lock is what's making all the rattle. then there is the outer door handle doing some little rattle as well. i like your idea and perhaps will try it in the near future when i find time to do it..

[soven]

subwoofer under seat will work but there are hardly any space under there. most subs need a 30liter box and you wont be getting it underneath the seat.

For door speakers, it is not directional up to 200-250hz according to many. If you have a subwoofer in the trunk, run it to around 100hz maximum otherwise you will be able to tell where it is coming from. If you can still tell that there is a subwoofer back there, it is due to your interior trims vibrating , and you would be able to tell that there is a subwoofer behind there.

I had rattles too with the rods and the outer handle. I tightened the door handle and chuck abit of dynamat on it and the rattle went away.

As for your case, maybe visit some retail shops. Find speakers that give you enough bass and install them. Look at 2 way component sets. Entry level sets from Focal,DLS,Rainbow etc etc. will be good.

[rad1an7]

Rattling sounds could also mean your sub is bad lol...

The 8" stock subs (that come in the doors) blow out easily.

[jameslemanski]

Ive got 8 inch kicker subs in my doors (RMB8's) ... The reason why i put them is is because they're more secure than a sub in the boot and im probably overly paranoid about getting broken into (aparantly bristol is the car crime capital of the UK!)!

Yes they did rattle a hell of a lot before i deadened the doors. Theyre infinatly better now (especially when the doors warm up! as its about -3 degrees here at the mo!)

Either way there are a few pointers that i can give you:

1- buy "free air" subs - these are designed not to be in enclosed spaces (so are for places like doors).

2- one of the main problems with subs is that there are no mid range frequencies... this means you need to get some awesome 6.5" rear speakers as well as some decent tweeters to cover the midrange.

3- amp them. They sound useless without as you need lots of watts to power 8"s generally

4- sound deaden. Ive used fairly cheap ivanhoe stuff but it makes such a difference. Also make sure its thougherly warm and clean before you attach it otherwise it wont stick and will fall off. Make sure you use as much as you can!

Hope this helps

[pepsiman]

Thanks for all the help could i get a free air sub and put it under the passenger seat that away it wouldnt need a properly sized box to work right...but the door idea still sounds pretty good too. either way i go it seems i would need some free air subs but anyways im just gonna figure on it some thanks again for helpin out

[pepsiman]

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/v3/p...7969765,00.html

maybe one of them?

[soven]

i really suggest having a look at component speakers in the shops etc.There are speakers that can play as low as 50hz and I find it unneccessary to even run a sub at times.

whatever speaker it is, be it a 4inch one or a 12inch sub. The main thing you need to do is to separate the back wave from the front wave. Speaker has sound coming from the front and its back(magnet) since it is just vibrating and moving air. If you dont separate the front and the back, everything would suffer. bass,quality etc etc.

in the doors, the inner door skin(where speaker mounts) separates them to an extent(very minimal). To go one step further, people use sound deadening on the inner skin to slow down the backwave even more so that it doesnt not interfere with the sound in the car cabin.

for a subwoofer, the 18mm mdf does that job.

hope it is easy enough to understand. for those who are jumping around thinking of dipole etc...can leave that for another thread.

[sh0x]

I put Dynamat on my outer door skin and it didn't seem to help too much. I have a friend who says stuffing carpet pad into the bottom of the door works well. I'm going to try it myself here in a couple of weeks, although I'm wondering if there will be a problem with it retaining moisture?

Also, I did not buy free air subs. They sort of thwack when they hit hard. Anybody know if installing a baffle would help the speakers perform? Trying not to spend too much money here.

[Negative]

I wouldn't put sibs in the door just for the simple fact that there are too many moving [and expensive] parts in the door for all that vibration. Subs also tend to be directionless sound when installed properly so it would matter much where you installed them.
One of my MR2T friends has his 12 in the frunk and it feels fine in the car even at speeds with the turbo screaming.
[And yes I meant "F"runk ]

This post has been edited by Negative: Mar 21, 2007 - 3:04 PM

[applejax]

soven makes some very good points as to why subs in the doors are very difficult.

If you put subs in the doors, you will need to totally seal them off, at minimum so the front is sealed from the back (this includes any other holes in the inside metal of the door). There are many other reasons why it is a tough idea to just consider getting the sub in a door correctly in the first place, but let's also examine some other issues if you did manage to get the subs in there.

You need mids and tweets up there, be they seperate components or stuck together in a coaxial speaker. Tweets (if seperate) are pretty easy to move around, but you'd need to have some sort of location for the mids, be it in custom kickpanels or in a further modification of the door itself (keep in mind here that the mid would need its own airspace, seperate from the sub).

A better option, given your concerns, would be to put the subs in your deck or trunk (coupe, right?), and either move those 6x9's, or more ideally get a nice coaxial or component set, into the doors.

This post has been edited by applejax: Mar 22, 2007 - 9:46 AM

[sh0x]

soven makes some very good points as to why subs in the doors are very difficult.

If you put subs in the doors, you will need to totally seal them off, at minimum so the front is sealed from the back (this includes any other holes in the inside metal of the door). There are many other reasons why it is a tough idea to just consider getting the sub in a door correctly in the first place, but let's also examine some other issues if you did manage to get the subs in there.

You need mids and tweets up there, be they seperate components or stuck together in a coaxial speaker. Tweets (if seperate) are pretty easy to move around, but you'd need to have some sort of location for the mids, be it in custom kickpanels or in a further modification of the door itself (keep in mind here that the mid would need its own airspace, seperate from the sub).

A better option, given your concerns, would be to put the subs in your deck or trunk (coupe, right?), and either move those 6x9's, or more ideally get a nice coaxial or component set, into the doors.

See, here's the problem, it's not a coupe, it's a convertible. I already have barely enough room in the trunk to pack a couple suitcases when I travel. So installing in the trunk was out for me. Good news is, I just found out that these actually are free-air subs, and I just didn't realize it. See link below. So the thwack from the speaker must be that it's not installed tight enough in the door. That opening seems like it's not quite 8", so maybe I'll just have to ream it out a bit or fab some kind of slightly enlarged foam gasket to go between the speaker and opening.

http://www.bizrate.com/carsubwoofers/mtx-t...+subwoofer.html

As for the frequency range problem, The tweets on the doorjamb and the upgraded 2-way speakers in the back sound pretty good, right now I have no amp connected to the front sub at the moment and it sounds OK the way it is, minus the extra bass punch. I have a Profile HA700M amp and with the crossover set to midrange it puts through some decent vocals as well.

I was thinking for good measure of installing a center speaker I saw that goes where the sunglass pocket is under the deck. like this one:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-PB60yiDkftT/c...mp;i=500SBS05DC

[applejax]

'verts are tough.

Free-air doesn't mean you can get away without seperating the backwave from the frontwave. You'll need to make sure there are no leaks in the door that will let that backpressure out. You'll also need to deaden like crazy to supress the flexing and vibrations of the door.

I still say subs in the doors aren't the answer, though. You would be much better off, as soven said, by putting a nice pair of components up there instead.

I'd focus on fixing some of the other deficiencies in your system before you mess with a center channel - but hey, if it suits you, then that's what counts.

[sh0x]

'verts are tough.

Free-air doesn't mean you can get away without seperating the backwave from the frontwave. You'll need to make sure there are no leaks in the door that will let that backpressure out. You'll also need to deaden like crazy to supress the flexing and vibrations of the door.

I still say subs in the doors aren't the answer, though. You would be much better off, as soven said, by putting a nice pair of components up there instead.

I'd focus on fixing some of the other deficiencies in your system before you mess with a center channel - but hey, if it suits you, then that's what counts.

I don't think sealing the door is a good idea, because when water gets in it needs a way to get out. Plus wouldn't that make the door vibration much worse? Finally, I'm not even sure sealing the door is possible because of the window seal at the top. What would you do there?

What do you think about putting baffles in to seal the sub instead of trying to seal the door? Should I use soft foam or harder plastic? I am for sure going to try my hardest to make this work before I just give up and put 3-ways in the door. I just don't want to scrap what seems to me like a good idea that just has a lot of challenges.

I really think it does suit me, because I really liked it when I installed one sub in one door, just need to tighten it up a bit and do the other side once I get it figured out. Thanks for your input!

[applejax]

Ah, sneaky, we switched people. Didn't catch that the first go around.

You are realizing the difficulties of the task at hand. It would seem best to first determine exactly where and how you are going to mount the sub. Any solution, at minimum, should be sturdy (the less flex and vibration, the better), and needs to seperate the backwaves from the forwardwaves. Once that is done, then you can choose a sub that is designed to operate in the enviornment you've created, whether it be infinite baffle or .3 cubic feet of airspace, 10 watts of power or 500.

This post has been edited by applejax: Mar 22, 2007 - 2:31 PM

[sh0x]

Ah, sneaky, we switched people. Didn't catch that the first go around.

You are realizing the difficulties of the task at hand. It would seem best to first determine exactly where and how you are going to mount the sub. Any solution, at minimum, should be sturdy (the less flex and vibration, the better), and needs to seperate the backwaves from the forwardwaves. Once that is done, then you can choose a sub that is designed to operate in the enviornment you've created, whether it be infinite baffle or .3 cubic feet of airspace, 10 watts of power or 500.

I completely forgot that I was threadjacking. I came in to offer a thought on the subject, then ask a question, then lost track of how the conversation started. Sorry! OK well lots of good info, I really am going to try and see how it works, and if it works, I'll tell you how, and if it doesn't, I'll tell you how far I went before I gave up.