6th Gen Celica Rally Car AWD Build, Rebuilding after the roll..... Options

[czwalga]

I just bought a 95 celica GT liftback for the sole purpose of rally racing. I'm building it to meet Rally America and NASA specs.



I'm scrolling through reading as much as I can about the car, but any opinions on weak areas on this car would be appreciated; as in stresses a rally car might really effect. I will be welding as many seems as I can find, at minimum 6 point cage, but i'll probably make it 8 as i plan on going through the firewall to the front strut towers. Basically just reinforcing anything I can. My goal is to compete in blackriver stages next september.

This post has been edited by czwalga: Aug 6, 2012 - 7:31 AM

[mkernz22]

Welcome to the forum!
Good Luck with the build man! That is going to be a project in a half!
Engine wise, go with a 2nd or 3rd Gen 3sgte engine. You can get a 3rd Gen 3sgte from _Jim_ at a decent price!
Also, are you looking to do the AWD conversion?

[czwalga]

Welcome to the forum!
Good Luck with the build man! That is going to be a project in a half!
Engine wise, go with a 2nd or 3rd Gen 3sgte engine. You can get a 3rd Gen 3sgte from _Jim_ at a decent price!
Also, are you looking to do the AWD conversion?

Thanks! For the first year i'm not looking to upgrade the engine or do AWD. I made that mistake with my rx7. I built my rx7 to road race with only having minimum road racing experience. I built a car that I can't even track because well its basically too god damn scary for my driving skills. So that car just now turned into a drag/street car.

Like I said I learned my lesson and am starting small with this build!

[Tigawoods]

i knew i recognized the 7!
i was on pittspeed looking for nice cars to shoot and yours came up.
never got the chance to contact you about it, might have to set something up
good to have you here
who lead you to a celica?

[Johnnyny]

a good rear strut brace will go a long way

[stl95celica]

You should also try an hit the 100 Acre Wood rally in Salem, MO. I went last year for the first time and it made me a huge fan now. it would be sweet to see a celica compete.

Whats the engine class do you plan on competing in?

[czwalga]

i knew i recognized the 7!
i was on pittspeed looking for nice cars to shoot and yours came up.
never got the chance to contact you about it, might have to set something up
good to have you here
who lead you to a celica?

Basically I was looking for something cheap, semi sporty looking, FWD. I really don't like FWD, but they say it's the easiest to learn to rally on. So I can start with this then who knows maybe get crazy. After the rx7 i'm not opposed to any type of extreme one-off mods, maybe awd v8 haha.

The cars I was looking at were preludes, celicas, was considering a 1st gen rx7 for a bit, 240sx.

[DEATH]

the 6th Gen Celica was designed specifically FOR the World Ralley Cup so you are alot of the way there. That being said, you got the watered down USDM version so you got a lot of work to do.
In the end the Celica GT4 is still a world class ralley car that can hang with the best of them [properly setup, of course] Evo's, STI's etc
I'd start by Youtube'ing some races [keywords: Celica rally ST205 ST185 ST165]
good luck and take lots of vids to load here on this site [to pay us back for all the help ]

This post has been edited by DEATH: Sep 28, 2010 - 11:45 AM

[richee3]

Contact windowlicker. He's a member on here who rallies his Celica. He's not on that often anymore but I'm sure he'd respond to a PM.

[BonzaiCelica]

yes I always to talk to windowlicker, you should see his car in person its so beat up from all the rally he does down here in California. He tells me that he does pretty good considering he has stock suspension and its an auto st. so its way underpowered and auto but he does pretty damn good out there from what he's told me. shoot him a pm he'll surely respond to you.

[czwalga]

Cool Ill have to PM him.


Does he do actual rally events or rally cross, there's a big difference in specs you have to meet.

[BonzaiCelica]

Cool Ill have to PM him.


Does he do actual rally events or rally cross, there's a big difference in specs you have to meet.

I believe its rally autocross its out in the middle of the dessert. check out his posts so you can see his pics and stuff of him taking turns and what not.

[Tigawoods]

he does rallycross.
rally is a whole different ball game.

[Coomer]

Welcome! Looking forward to watching your rally car build.

[windowlicker]

my ears were burning cause someone was talking about me..lol

good to see another person on here getting interested in rally with their celica. the best thing to do would be to start with reading the hell out of the rally america/rally car rule books. rally america is changing over to the name rally car, but i'm pretty sure that the rules are not going to change much in the way of what you will need to do with the cage. i think you're also gonna be stuck with what ever engine you currently have as you will need to build up your coefficents (kinda like your racing licenses) in order to move up to faster cars. they don't just let you build a fast unlimited awd car without knowing you can drive it and not kill yourself and others. personally, i am a huge advocate of starting off in a slow car, learning better techniques, then moving up with power after you've learned as much as you can in a slow car.

there are a couple really good websites that you will be able to ask more questions pertaining to rally orientated stuff. the first one is specialstage.com and its mainly stage rally guys on there, but its got a lot of good info. the other is a site i frequent a lot and its got a lot of info on a lot of various types of rally orientated things and its called dirtyimpreza.com don't be scared away because it at first look seems like a subaru only site, because there are quite a few of us that don't have subaru's, but we go on there for info on racing, find events that are local to you, and there are some good vendors for rally related stuff on there.

i strongly urge that if there is a rallyx event in your area, get out there and get some seat time. the more seat time and in a "race" setting you get, the better. a lot of the guys out here that run stage rally are also big into rallyx because it allows them to get the practice they need on some technical driving skills in between stage rallies. for me, its the only economical rally events that i can afford to compete in at the moment with my celica. i also really enjoy it as well and the car does pretty decent. i was really surprised with it the first rallyx i drove in and have been really happy with the car ever since (i'm about to finish 2 full seasons of rallyx with the celica). the thing i really like with the car is that it rotates well in the dirt with left foot braking. i never really cared much for left foot braking on pavement, but on dirt, its amazing how well the car will turn when timed out right. also having a slower car is kinda nice because there are a lot of times when i just keep the throttle pinned and don't really need to lift at all.

if you have more questions, feel free to ask.

[czwalga]

my ears were burning cause someone was talking about me..lol

good to see another person on here getting interested in rally with their celica. the best thing to do would be to start with reading the hell out of the rally america/rally car rule books. rally america is changing over to the name rally car, but i'm pretty sure that the rules are not going to change much in the way of what you will need to do with the cage. i think you're also gonna be stuck with what ever engine you currently have as you will need to build up your coefficents (kinda like your racing licenses) in order to move up to faster cars. they don't just let you build a fast unlimited awd car without knowing you can drive it and not kill yourself and others. personally, i am a huge advocate of starting off in a slow car, learning better techniques, then moving up with power after you've learned as much as you can in a slow car.

there are a couple really good websites that you will be able to ask more questions pertaining to rally orientated stuff. the first one is specialstage.com and its mainly stage rally guys on there, but its got a lot of good info. the other is a site i frequent a lot and its got a lot of info on a lot of various types of rally orientated things and its called dirtyimpreza.com don't be scared away because it at first look seems like a subaru only site, because there are quite a few of us that don't have subaru's, but we go on there for info on racing, find events that are local to you, and there are some good vendors for rally related stuff on there.

i strongly urge that if there is a rallyx event in your area, get out there and get some seat time. the more seat time and in a "race" setting you get, the better. a lot of the guys out here that run stage rally are also big into rallyx because it allows them to get the practice they need on some technical driving skills in between stage rallies. for me, its the only economical rally events that i can afford to compete in at the moment with my celica. i also really enjoy it as well and the car does pretty decent. i was really surprised with it the first rallyx i drove in and have been really happy with the car ever since (i'm about to finish 2 full seasons of rallyx with the celica). the thing i really like with the car is that it rotates well in the dirt with left foot braking. i never really cared much for left foot braking on pavement, but on dirt, its amazing how well the car will turn when timed out right. also having a slower car is kinda nice because there are a lot of times when i just keep the throttle pinned and don't really need to lift at all.

if you have more questions, feel free to ask.

How has the car held up over the last 2 years? Any weak points on the stock suspension? I'm going to try and make a rallyx before I definatly want to however the only place that was semi-close shut down over the summer.

I completely agree about starting small, i'm not doing anything to the engine atleast for a while. Like I said I learned my lesson with the rx7, built to road race, waaaay to fast to road race for my driving skills. Now its just a drag/street car.


Anyways the one good thing is i'm not going in blind. One of my friends convinced me to do rally instead of build another road race car (one that I could actually drive). He has a 90's CRX. I really dont like CRX's but this one is pretty cool. Built to meet RA and NASA specs.

[windowlicker]

the car has held up really well for the beating i give it and having 210,000 miles. everything i've replaced has been stuff you would normally replace on a 210,000 mile car, so its not like doing rallyx is killing the car. here's what i've replaced so far:
driver side axle
driver side wheel bearings three times (2 of the times they were cheap autozone bearings, now it has new toyota bearings on both sides)
front and rear motor mounts and trans mount
driver side ball joints twice (first was autozone POS ball joint, now has new toyota ball joints on both sides)
exhaust manifold (original 7afe manifolds are prone to crack over time)
windshield (severely cracked when bought from the previous owner)
power steering pump
the three exterior engine belts (power steering, alternator, and a/c belts)
spark plugs and spark plug wires
distributor cap and rotor

other than that, i've just done the routine oil changes and keeping an eye on things. like i said, a lot of the stuff i changed out were parts that originally came on the car back in 1996, so they would have needed to be changed anyways. i'm looking to swap over to a manual trans and i'm debating if i want to do a rebuild on the engine or just do a timing belt and water pump, and a rear main seal when i swap out the trans.

there are some nice things about the car, its really easy to work on by yourself. i love how easy it is to change out the whole steering knuckle assembly and especially that the ball joints are bolt in vs press in. anything that doesn't require a shop press is good in my book.

i would recommend getting a good skid plate custom made, as i sometimes worry about punching a hole in either the engine oil pan or the trans pan. i'm working on getting a better one on my car, but i have a ghetto fabbed skid plate that i made out of a benz clk 63 hood. works, but i need to find some better mounting points since i ripped the plate off in a rallyx.

This post has been edited by windowlicker: Sep 29, 2010 - 1:30 PM

[czwalga]

That's not bad at all...basic stuff. That is nice about the bolt in ball joints as well. I have a 20-ton press, but i'd much rather prefer the bolt in method.


Good call on the skid plate i'll probably build a skid plate for it. I dont like paying anyone to do anything



I pick the car up tomorrow, so I'll try to do a continuous build thread for it with pics.

This post has been edited by czwalga: Sep 30, 2010 - 8:22 AM

[Tigawoods]

where are you around pittsburgh?

[windowlicker]

cool, look forward to seeing what you do with the car.