AT vs ST chassis differences? Options

[Nespeed]

Just looking for info on the major to minor differences between a AT and ST chassis.

[BonzaiCelica]

same!!! except sway bar thickness. but aftermarket sway bars will fix that in a jif

This post has been edited by BonzaiCelica: Jan 6, 2013 - 2:59 PM

[Nespeed]

What about motor mount locations?

[RabidTRD]

The chassis is the same for the ST and GT.

Brakes are drum in the back of the ST and the GT has disk. ST has a different engine, hence different mounting locations, but the holes for the GT mounts are still there / indents in the frame are there. Most ST's don't come with the front factory strut stabilizer bar. Sway bars can be different, but they're different throughout each model as well. I guess it depended on who was putting the car together that day.

[Nespeed]

The chassis is the same for the ST and GT.

Brakes are drum in the back of the ST and the GT has disk. ST has a different engine, hence different mounting locations, but the holes for the GT mounts are still there / indents in the frame are there. Most ST's don't come with the front factory strut stabilizer bar. Sway bars can be different, but they're different throughout each model as well. I guess it depended on who was putting the car together that day.

Great, thanks for the info. Picked up a 94 st for nothing, and trying to figure out if its worth getting a gt4 clip. Just want to understand what I'm in for with this project. Having a difficult time gathering factual information from many celica forums, I've been around the block and the hardcore info is scares.

This post has been edited by Nespeed: Jan 6, 2013 - 7:37 PM

[Special_Edy]

AT = A series engine
ST = S series engine

The GT(ST204) and ST(AT200) are an identical chassis, the ST(AT200) has different engine/transmission mounts that are designed for the A series engine, whereas the GT(ST204) SSII/SSIII(ST202) and GT4(ST205) are all equipped to accept S series engines(3sfe, 3sge, 3sgte and 5sfe)

The GT4(ST205) has a different floorpan than all the other models of celicas, from the firewall back, so that it can fit the rear differential and driveshaft. It should also be noted that the GT4 has an E series transmission instead of an S series, so the mounts are slightly different.

But to answer your question more directly everything from the GT4 front clip will bolt directly into your AT200, with the exception of the rear differential(if you want AWD) and the Passengerside engine mount(not sure but Ive heard AT200 owners have to drill out some premarked holes)
You will need either an S54 transmission from a GT(ST204) or an E153 from a camry, mr2 turbo, or solara to name a few. The AT200 transmission will not bolt directly to the 3sgte motor. The E153 is the transmission you want behind a 3sgte though, the S54 has weaker internals.

[richee3]

Edit: Never mind. Posted before reading.

This post has been edited by richee3: Jan 6, 2013 - 8:16 PM

[RabidTRD]

For the GT4 front clip there is a bar you'll need to make the hood and bumper sit right. They're cut higher than the factory one, but that bar bolts right to the standard chassis.

[Special_Edy]

For the GT4 front clip there is a bar you'll need to make the hood and bumper sit right. They're cut higher than the factory one, but that bar bolts right to the standard chassis.

Correct me if Im wrong, but he will have this donor part if he buys a donor clip, and I believe its only 4 spot welds on the sides and a couple of bolts in the middle. If you drill out the spotwelds, you can use a nut & bolt through the hole rather than rewelding it together.

[Nespeed]

Thanks for all the info, this will save me a lot of time. I had looked over the car and notice ill have to find a different gas tank or run a cell, and fab up mounts for the carrier bearing for the drive shaft. If I have a rear AWD subframe that should bolt up, correct? So next step is to find me a GT4 clip!

[GMan]

Thanks for all the info, this will save me a lot of time. I had looked over the car and notice ill have to find a different gas tank or run a cell, and fab up mounts for the carrier bearing for the drive shaft. If I have a rear AWD subframe that should bolt up, correct? So next step is to find me a GT4 clip!

The ST205 rear floor pan is unique to the GT4. The GT4 sub frame will not bolt up directly to other models.
Need to fab up mounts. I can and has been done. Not hard if you are good at welding. :-)
Gas tank for an ST205 or an ST185 could be used, just hangs a bit low.

Have you done a search for ST205 or AWD swaps ?
There were two in the MA area.

Regards;
------------------------


This post has been edited by GMan: Jan 7, 2013 - 9:07 PM

[Nespeed]

Thanks for all the info, this will save me a lot of time. I had looked over the car and notice ill have to find a different gas tank or run a cell, and fab up mounts for the carrier bearing for the drive shaft. If I have a rear AWD subframe that should bolt up, correct? So next step is to find me a GT4 clip!

The ST205 rear floor pan is unique to the GT4. The GT4 sub frame will not bolt up directly to other models.
Need to fab up mounts. I can and has been done. Not hard if you are good at welding. :-)
Gas tank for an ST205 or an ST185 could be used, just hangs a bit low.

Have you done a search for ST205 or AWD swaps ?
There were two in the MA area.

Regards;
------------------------

Oh ok, so my only concern is messing up the geometry of the suspension if things aren't straight. I have plenty of welding hrs, are these major changes to the mount locations on the subframe? I will do some seaching, thanks.

[garin]

motor mounts

[Special_Edy]

Thanks for all the info, this will save me a lot of time. I had looked over the car and notice ill have to find a different gas tank or run a cell, and fab up mounts for the carrier bearing for the drive shaft. If I have a rear AWD subframe that should bolt up, correct? So next step is to find me a GT4 clip!

If you read my previous post you will see that I have already answered this question. Slightly frustrating considering I type all my posts out on a cell phone.

AT = A series engine
ST = S series engine

The GT(ST204) and ST(AT200) are an identical chassis, the ST(AT200) has different engine/transmission mounts that are designed for the A series engine, whereas the GT(ST204) SSII/SSIII(ST202) and GT4(ST205) are all equipped to accept S series engines(3sfe, 3sge, 3sgte and 5sfe)

The GT4(ST205) has a different floorpan than all the other models of celicas, from the firewall back, so that it can fit the rear differential and driveshaft. It should also be noted that the GT4 has an E series transmission instead of an S series, so the mounts are slightly different.

But to answer your question more directly everything from the GT4 front clip will bolt directly into your AT200, with the exception of the rear differential(if you want AWD) and the Passengerside engine mount(not sure but Ive heard AT200 owners have to drill out some premarked holes)
You will need either an S54 transmission from a GT(ST204) or an E153 from a camry, mr2 turbo, or solara to name a few. The AT200 transmission will not bolt directly to the 3sgte motor. The E153 is the transmission you want behind a 3sgte though, the S54 has weaker internals.

You can either get the rear floorpans from a GT4 and weld them in, or you can weld mounts for the differential and driveshaft(you also must mount an aftermarket fuel cell with this route). The FWD celica has the fuel tank where the rear differential sits on the AWD, The AWD has a shallower trunk with the fuel tank mounted underneath.

This post has been edited by Special_Edy: Jan 7, 2013 - 10:29 PM