 3sgte, detail question! |
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 May 3, 2004 - 10:44 AM
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Enthusiast  Joined Mar 30, '04 From cali Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%)  |
I am planing to purchase the COMPLETE 95 3sgte engine us-spec with (lsd) tranny and also the axles, ecu and the uncut wire harness.
Here are some questions I have will all this be able to bolt on to my 5sfe raidiator? my a/c, heater, etc. because man its summer i dont wanna lose the a/c or spend another $$$$ to get it working. With the things i have listed I shouldnt have to buy anything esle right? im planing to convert the Rwd tranny into a Fwd. Following the steps on celica.net, But im spending well over 4000 for the items in the First paragraph. I do not want spend anymore then I will be planing to spend. And a clip is not a answer to this question; because i live in California and the egr system must be intact so it will be Carb legal in California. -------------------- RIP-1995 Toyota Celica GT
Riding a 2002 Honda Civic HB Si |
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May 3, 2004 - 11:26 AM
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 Enthusiast Joined Apr 15, '03 From San Jose, CA, USA Currently Offline Reputation: 1 (100%) |
Where are you going to find a good condition, smog passing, 95 3s-gte from an MR2? for a good price. Also, turbo engines put out possibly higher emisions, and since your car is not listed as a turbo it might not pass smog still.
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May 3, 2004 - 11:59 AM
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 Moderator Joined Oct 1, '02 From fall river, ma Currently Offline Reputation: 13 (100%) |
for some reason, they say the 3rd gen 3sgte will not pass the smog test....
-------------------- Former Team 5SFTE pro member ;)
 13.6@108MPH, 5SFTE Powered |
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May 3, 2004 - 3:19 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Sep 22, '03 Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Yeah you will need to buy a lot more stuff....You are thinking that the swap is way to easy where you just put the engine in and your done. There is troubleshooting, custom axles, WIRING(HARDEST PART), FMIC, Exhaust, etc...If 95 US spec then that means MR2, which has a SMIC, so you will probably need to make a custom FMIC.
There are a lot of things you need to do so if you search the forum you will find out what you need to do. A/C is a problem it probably will not work bolting it in. You WILL spend more than what you are getting....costs add up. The engine is carb legal and smog legal in a MR2 but not in a 6GC. Swapping engines from another model car is not legal.....plus since it is US SPEC the egnine may have a lot of mileage which may cause it not to pass smog. |
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May 3, 2004 - 6:59 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Mar 30, '04 From cali Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Actually the engine i had found only has 83'000 miles on it. And it is california certified because NY and Ca has the same rules on smog!
-------------------- RIP-1995 Toyota Celica GT
Riding a 2002 Honda Civic HB Si |
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May 3, 2004 - 7:46 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Sep 22, '03 Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
83,000 miles is still a lot, considering that JDM engines have from 20-40000 miles and can pass smog more easily than a US Spec if it is not visual.
Comparing 95 US Spec VS. JDM you will have the same issues with smog except that the JDM may be better off on the sniffer test, has 25 more HP, and has a considerably less amount of mileages like half of the engine you want. It also seems that it would be cheaper going with JDM if you are paying over $4000. |
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May 4, 2004 - 1:07 AM
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 Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
The MR2 3SGTE (USDM 1995 Spec) uses different mounting pisitions for all of the accesories... so all mounting brackets (maybe crank pulley) and possibly accesories built for a front mounted setup will be needed to be sourced also. The stock components (a/c lines, condenser, resivoirs, etc...) should all work ok assuming they can bolt up correctly. FMIC isn't absolutely necessary... but should be considered. You can use the MR2 side mount... as for smog... if the original EGR lines and stuff is all there... it should all be ok. Those may need to be swapped and functioning for it to pass (assuming you try to pass it legally).
-------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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May 4, 2004 - 1:50 PM
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Enthusiast Joined May 1, '03 From Michigan Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
JDM motors do not have the emissions systems that USDM cars do - like the EGR. Thats why the 3rd gens dont pass smog tests. The motor in the USDM 1995 MR2 is the 2nd gen 3SGTE, which will have all the needed devices to pass smog. Price wise, a good 2nd gen should cost less then $1500.
That all depends on the motor. The import companies usually have no real record of mileage, unless the car has the odometer still attached. The 40K mile estimate is only an estimate based on the standard driving habits of the average Japanese person. I bought a 95 3SGE with 'low miles' and found that it had been sitting for quite a while, and had massive build up on the cylinders. There is always a risk when buying another motor. I always open it up, replace the head gasket, and check out the internals. This post has been edited by scothaniel: May 4, 2004 - 2:01 PM -------------------- Scott
West Michigan |
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May 4, 2004 - 1:57 PM
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Moderator Joined Oct 1, '02 From fall river, ma Currently Offline Reputation: 13 (100%) |
all gen JDM 3s' dont have egr equipment on them...but the 2nd gen will pass the sniffer test..the 3rd wont.... This post has been edited by presure2: May 4, 2004 - 1:58 PM -------------------- Former Team 5SFTE pro member ;)
13.6@108MPH, 5SFTE Powered |
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May 4, 2004 - 2:39 PM
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 Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '04 From LA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Actually, a JDM engine puts out cleaner air than a US engine with all the EGR crap on it, etc. THats what he means by passing smog easier. On visual check tho.. :/
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May 4, 2004 - 2:59 PM
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Enthusiast Joined May 1, '03 From Michigan Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Why? The engines are identical, except the US motor has an EGR. Nothing else is different?
The only thing I could think of is the state of the engine - a properly tuned motor will burn more efficiantly. If the JDM motor was rebuilt, or freshened up, maybe it would be cleaner then an old US motor with the EGR equipment. -------------------- Scott
West Michigan |
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May 4, 2004 - 4:09 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Sep 22, '03 Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
He was stating for "Visual" Purposes...without the EGR it won't pass.
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May 4, 2004 - 4:12 PM
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 Enthusiast Joined Nov 15, '02 From Corona & Vallejo, CA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Um... both my brother and I passed the sniffer... and we both have 3rd gens. We just managed to convince the smogger to test our cars, regardless of not having an EGR. This post has been edited by kuya1284: May 4, 2004 - 4:12 PM |
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May 4, 2004 - 4:15 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Nov 15, '02 From Corona & Vallejo, CA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I don't think that's true. |
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May 4, 2004 - 4:16 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Nov 15, '02 From Corona & Vallejo, CA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I'm seriously laughing at some of the posts here...
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May 4, 2004 - 6:45 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Sep 22, '03 Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Well I passed mine too since I can smog it myself, but if a Smogger were to thoroughly visually check your engine, and it doesn't have a EGR or if its not the proper engine it will fail....especially since California is expecting the Smoggers to fail 20% of the cars they smog a month. "They have to find any way to fail cars to prevent inspections. hehe...its just something California wants so there are always someway to get around California laws.
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May 4, 2004 - 7:48 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I'm laughing also... Considering I'll be working part-time as at a Smog shop this summer... I guess I'll clear the confusion here. First off, No... a JDM motor doesn't burn any cleaner than a USDM motor... why would they? Technically speaking... the motors aren't very different... As for swapping and passing smog... you won't legally with a JDM motor (meaning the inspector knows it's a swap and goes through the ENTIRE smog process). That's that. The processes of going through BAR and getting a smog sticker for your car is very hard to impossible, especially with a JDM motor. EVERYTHING is needed... from EGR equipment (they check and make sure the EGR functions), COMPLETE wiring (they literally whip out a wiring diagram and follow each wire to make sure it's connected and operating properly), all smog components are in place (vaccum lines, CAT, O2, etc...), and check to make sure the motor is operating at FACTORY emission levels (stock timing, boost, rpms, etc...) All in all... it's very very difficult to do, especially in California. If swapping a different motor... the motor must be from a car of the same year, or newer. All in all... for those who are whining that it's dumb to get a USDM 95 MR2 3SGTE... you're all clueless... in a sense. In CA... it's a good legal idea and way of swapping a 50 state smog legal 3SGTE FF Celica... especially when you can't afford to spend a few hundred dollars "under the table" to "smog" your swapped car every 2 years (I don't have to really... family smog operation...>=P). JDM motors are VERY hard to legalize in CA... -------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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May 4, 2004 - 7:52 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '04 From LA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
.... Japan has stricker emissions laws than even california, hence, their motors manufactured for domestic use put out even less. I'm not saying I know how they do it, or whats in place (not an EGR it seems ) but a JDM motor will pass if it's just the emissions.
--Sean PS: My minors Japanese/Japan Cultural Studies.... I'm not some wacko going: In Japan, they were burger wrappers for hats! |
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May 4, 2004 - 8:12 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Wrong... they use cleaner burning fuel and run leaner fuel maps in stock trim... engines are technically the same... and yes... a JDM motor can pass tailpipe and dyno smog, but that doesn't mean they're legal... nor does it mean they'll run cleaner than a USDM motor (when they're swapped into a USDM car at least). -------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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May 4, 2004 - 8:37 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '04 From LA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I never said they were legal- and nothing about that statement is wrong- you just pointed out they use cleaner fuel. You'll note that I stated I didn't know how they put out cleaner emissions.
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