5sfe build? Options

[cavernouspluto]

I've been looking into getting more power out of my 94 gt, i don't want to turbo it or swap to a 3sgte. so is it possible to build a reliable na 5sfe that will push around 200bhp?

[Smaay]

never happen. the 5S wont make that power without some sort of forced induction.

you could squeeze it with a 50 shot of juice.

[Rusty]

Is there a reason you don't want to turbo?
Any interest in swapping to a NA engine such as 3S-GE, BEAMS or V6.

Other thing is to look at is its handling. With mounts bushes and other suspension items.

[doory100]

QUOTE (Tigawoods @ Aug 30, 2014 - 7:25 PM)

basics for cammed 5s: 1. Camshafts 264 from delta cams 2. Shims 3. SAFC 4. Wideband A/F gauge
thats what im doing should get me 30-40 hp
+ shaving the head in a port and polish

This post has been edited by doory100: Sep 11, 2014 - 9:16 AM

[Tigawoods]

camshafts and a good tune will MAYBE get you 30hp if you are really lucky.

You wont be hitting 200hp on the 5S. It would be cheaper to buy a Red top beams


oh and the V6...I always forger about that option

This post has been edited by Tigawoods: Sep 11, 2014 - 7:27 AM

[doory100]

Beams parts are not easy to get and cost alot. On the other hand 5sfe parts are easy and cheap toget

[richee3]

Beams parts are not easy to get and cost alot. On the other hand 5sfe parts are easy and cheap toget

Most BEAMS parts are readily available in the North America. They are NOT hard to get at all and they don't cost any more than any other engine. It would cost entirely too much for Toyota to build an engine that uses it's own unique parts so a ton of parts on the BEAMS are used on other engines.

[Smaay]

the BEAMS will get you probably 170-180 HP and 140 TQ to the wheels (someone correct me if im wrong)

the 1MZ will get you 190-200 HP and about the same torque to the wheels.

the 3MZ will get you 220 HP and 240 TQ to the wheels. (its awesome BTW)

[CrossCudi]

the 3MZ will get you 220 HP and 240 TQ to the wheels. (its awesome BTW)

is there a link to this ??? would like to read about it

[ILoveMySilly97]

I believe the 5sfe can make 200 hp with some serious money and serious time. Do the basics cams, bolt ons, port match everything, and shave the head. Along with a good tune and you should hit close to 150-170whp.

No one likes the 5sfe because it's an be that requires serious time and money that no one is willing to build. Its up to you if you want to take that chance or not.

[ILoveMySilly97]

Here's two links on a tip for 5sfe na builds. From mild to racing.

http://www.mr2oc.com/showthread.php?t=308405

http://www.mr2.com/forums/threads/31459-Ge...induction/page3

[cavernouspluto]

Is there a reason you don't want to turbo?
Any interest in swapping to a NA engine such as 3S-GE, BEAMS or V6.

Other thing is to look at is its handling. With mounts bushes and other suspension items.

I don't want to deal with the extra hassle of a turbo: the extra strain on the motor, the cost and trouble I'd get my self into haha
Plus I'd like to build a 5sfe just because a lot of people just swap to a better motor

[Rusty]

There is a reason why not many people do a 5S-FE build, its because the 5s isn't the best starting point for making NA power, compared to other celica engines


Start out by pricing up the items needed for a high power NA 5S, total it up. Also look up the prices of turboing your 5S-FE (5S-FE+T). And lastly the prices of beams redtop/greytop, 3rdgen 3S-GE
I suggest at looking at Manny's (Presure2) 5S-FE+T build, so you can see what is needed.

What you should start to see, is NA tuning is quite expensive for lower results. That a 3S-GE or beams will get you a closer to your power goals alot easier with less work & effort, more drivability. They will be more reliable & will be easier in getting more power out of it - should you choose to down the line.

In terms of swapping a 3rdgen 3S-GE is the easiest followed by the beams.

Check the above NA sticky, and you'll see these threads

3S-GE BEAMS Redtop Information Thread
ACIS & BEAMS (3S-GE) Discussion thread.
3rd Gen 3S-GE swapping
BEAMS 3S-GE Wiring




If you're still not sort what to do engine wise. Leave it and focus getting your 'slow' celica to handle fast.

[ILoveMySilly97]

^+1, my in law told me the same thing. To make easier, cheaper, and power. Go with some type of forced induction. NA builds are costly and is hard to put power out.

[cavernouspluto]

I've thought about swapping to a 3sge but my dads buddy builds race engines and said he could do some engine work for cheap so thats why was looking in to building the current engine i have but if the 3sge is a much better option then i might consider it

thanks for all the input! i have a lot of options to think about

[1994Celica]

Well said Rusty! I thought I was just going to tune my 5s up a bit like the op and call it good. However after looking at all the options an NA 5s just isn't good. Id much rather invest that money in a better engine . If one is concerned with reliability and parts availability than the v6 swap is a great option.

[FrankB2]

My '97 vert GT has 133,000 miles on its 5SFE engine, and it runs perfect. The car handles like it's on rails, and I sometimes wonder if the V6 would make life a little more exciting. Does the V6 weigh much more than the 5SFE? I don't want to mess with the car's already great handling by adding a heavy motor.

[955SFE]

My '97 vert GT has 133,000 miles on its 5SFE engine, and it runs perfect. The car handles like it's on rails, and I sometimes wonder if the V6 would make life a little more exciting. Does the V6 weigh much more than the 5SFE? I don't want to mess with the car's already great handling by adding a heavy motor.

I'm pretty sure 1mz-fe is lighter than a 5sfe.
1Mzfe is pretty much all aluminum
5sfe aluminum/ cast iron (this is the problem)

I'm building up the suspension as well. Moving to a 1mzfe would benefit more. More power and less weight in the front.

This post has been edited by 955SFE: Sep 13, 2014 - 3:03 PM

[FrankB2]

Well.... That's my next project, at least once 5sfe shows a single sign of being tired. Thanks for the info!

My '97 vert GT has 133,000 miles on its 5SFE engine, and it runs perfect. The car handles like it's on rails, and I sometimes wonder if the V6 would make life a little more exciting. Does the V6 weigh much more than the 5SFE? I don't want to mess with the car's already great handling by adding a heavy motor.

I'm pretty sure 1mz-fe is lighter than a 5sfe.
1Mzfe is pretty much all aluminum
5sfe aluminum/ cast iron (this is the problem)

I'm building up the suspension as well. Moving to a 1mzfe would benefit more. More power and less weight in the front.

[Syaoran]

It's been estimated before that the 1MZ weighs just as much as the 5S with twice the power, less than a 3sgte fully equipped with just as much power.

The 3mz weight a bit closer to the 3sgte, but is also more powerful than a gen 3 3sgte.