Fixing a 2nd gen 3sgte harness / preping for my swap, no, its not going in Jenns car, its going in MINE! ;) Options

[presure2]

so yea,
as most of ya know, we recently did up a 3rd gen swap for jim and as "payment" he gave me his 2nd gen setup.
as most of ya also know, this setup was originally RJB23's car, which was pretty much a mess from the day jim and shannon bought it.
Click me for details of that story

so once we got the 2nd gen motor up here, it has been sitting on a stand, waiting its turn.
i finally got around to getting the harness off, and am starting to get it cleaned, stripped, repaired, rerouted, rewrapped, and reloomed.
like everything else about the swap in that car, this engine harness was no diffrent, and in defense to the guy who did it (IIRC DGperformace did it) it did work, it was just routed and wrapped all crazy, and the ECU end basicly looked like a birds nest from people troubleshooting the ecu and wiring while it was in the car.
so i started tearing into it, and dustin came by last night and helped me get the interior plugs sorted out, since there was lots of "dead" (wires that go to nowhere) wires in the harness.
i also removed all the stuff i wont need or use, including all the ac stuff, TVIS, TVSV, ect.
once that was done, i went about cleaning and fixing any loose or broken wires, (there were a few, one of which wouldnt allow the car to start with the key...lmao) and rerouting and rewrapping it, getting it ready to be reloomed.
here are a few pics of how that is going.

first, the before. sorry for the blurry pic, its the only one i took..lol



this wire was in the harness that was routed behind the intake manifold, instead of inside of it, like it should be, and chaffed on the IM until it broke..just so happens this is the wire that tells the starter to crank. yes, jim, this really is why your car wouldnt start with the key! lmao



how the ECU side of the harness looks now:



and some of the leftovers:


and just for refrence, a pic of what a stock USDM 3s harness looks like, for an idea of what this one should look like when its done.


ill keep updating this thread and adding pics as i go along and continue with the project.

[njccmd2002]

hey now that you bring it up. Wiring is the same for all swaps. Just different routes right. Just need to find the exact diagram.

What does it entail overall. moving the order of the pins in the plug, going from one place to another?

Can yo just post like a general of whts involved. Im assumming its just a basic rerouting of the wires. Just have to know where, right?

i would like to see that harness finished. Good job.

[Dr_Tweak]

Nice work. LOL, good old DG, huh?

[x_itchy_b_x]

haha thats classic.

You inspired me


This post has been edited by x_itchy_b_x: Dec 25, 2008 - 12:27 AM

[lagos]

In DGs defence I can tell you that this looks like all RJBs fault.
When DG helped me with my harness, we had an understanding that I would unloom and reloom it on my own, just in case i wanted to run things differently or had to troubleshoot something. It seems like RJB didn't do a proper job relooming the harness and didn't put a lot of the plastic protective tubing around the wiring. Not to mention that he didn't think to run the harness in front of the intake manifold and not behind it.

Manny, don't forget to eliminate that fuel pump relay if your not using your resistor pack. If you don't then its only a matter of time till it fries on you.

Currently working on a 3s harness myself too...


This post has been edited by lagos: Dec 25, 2008 - 12:45 AM

[x_itchy_b_x]

Hahaha were all working on harness wtf. we should have had a harness party.

[lagos]

hey now that you bring it up. Wiring is the same for all swaps. Just different routes right. Just need to find the exact diagram.

What does it entail overall. moving the order of the pins in the plug, going from one place to another?

Can yo just post like a general of whts involved. Im assumming its just a basic rerouting of the wires. Just have to know where, right?

i would like to see that harness finished. Good job.

There is nothing basic about it.
You are trying to run an engine from a 5th gen, in your 6th gen car, so almost everything is different. But to give you an idea, you have to rewire the 3s harness to use the 5s fuse box and all of the plugs that interface with the rest of the car.

I might do a little write up (I've wanted to do one for like 4yrs now), but be warned ... this is really not something you should do if you don't know how to read wiring diagrams or are good at soldering/wiring. I'm usually a big supporter of people doing their own work, and learning about their car, but this is one area that you should probably outsource to someone like DrTweak.

Hahaha were all working on harness wtf. we should have had a harness party.

I'll bring the heat shrink and solder, you bring the hookers and coke.

[Dr_Tweak]

Wait, hookers? (puts on shoes)

Yeah Manny, I was going to ask if you are going to route the harness out the other side of the intake manifold housing.... like the USDM 3SGTE harness. That's how we route ours anyway, comes out pretty nice

-Doc

This post has been edited by Dr_Tweak: Dec 25, 2008 - 12:58 AM

[x_itchy_b_x]

I'll bring the heat shrink and solder, you bring the hookers and coke.

Deal.

[presure2]

Wait, hookers? (puts on shoes)

Yeah Manny, I was going to ask if you are going to route the harness out the other side of the intake manifold housing.... like the USDM 3SGTE harness. That's how we route ours anyway, comes out pretty nice

-Doc

wait...theres HOOKERS???

yea tweek, its just the way it "should" be done...
like art said, in dg's defense, im pretty sure he didnt wrap and route the harness...but then again, with how he assembled it, there wasnt much choice but to run it the way it was.
looking at it all apart, i dont see why he extended it so long...why not just route it properly, and it seems like it would be just long enough with just extending a few wires. right tweak?
my biggest complaint about his work is just all the leftover crap..i pulled prolly 15+ wires that just went nowhere, and did nothing, never mind the dead plugs..lol

so art to remove the fpr i just take the wires and attach them together, right?

[presure2]

hey now that you bring it up. Wiring is the same for all swaps. Just different routes right. Just need to find the exact diagram.

What does it entail overall. moving the order of the pins in the plug, going from one place to another?

Can yo just post like a general of whts involved. Im assumming its just a basic rerouting of the wires. Just have to know where, right?

i would like to see that harness finished. Good job.

the one good thing about this harness, is as hacked together as it was, it DID work, so everything was pretty much done for me, i just had to go back and clean everything up.

for someone who dont know the EWD books very well, or doesnt understand why, and how these systems work, my how to would look somthing like this:

remove 5s harness from engine.
remove 3s harness from engine.
get a box, and put them in it.
mail it to tweak, and if you have to, pay him extra to reloom it like factory, with payment.
wait for it to come back.
install 3sgte conversion harness.
trust me, you dont wanna get into this stuff unless your ready for a long hard road if you dont know exactly what your trying to do.
a 3rd gen swap is much easier in this respect, just a matter of repinning a handfull of wires, and adding a relay or 2 if you dont get a full clip.

i added in a pic in my first post of the old usdm 3s harness i had back in the day, for refrence on what the harness im working on should kinda end up looking like in the end.

[_Jim_]

LOL, OMG Manny......what a mess.

[99GT]

Hey Lagos, for two the white wires that goes to the alternator. Did you have to remove that from the big main wire? They both came together on one ring terminal correct?

Manny is there an easy way to take out the harness? Or do I have to remove the intake manifold?

This post has been edited by 99GT: Dec 25, 2008 - 9:40 AM

[njccmd2002]

There is nothing basic about it.
You are trying to run an engine from a 5th gen, in your 6th gen car, so almost everything is different. But to give you an idea, you have to rewire the 3s harness to use the 5s fuse box and all of the plugs that interface with the rest of the car.

I might do a little write up (I've wanted to do one for like 4yrs now), but be warned ... this is really not something you should do if you don't know how to read wiring diagrams or are good at soldering/wiring. I'm usually a big supporter of people doing their own work, and learning about their car, but this is one area that you should probably outsource to someone like DrTweak.

i love doing this crap. sounds like a lot of fun. well it will have to wait.

BTW to me its basic.

[lagos]

Manny... to ditch the fuel pump relay, take the 3 blue wires and solder them together. Then you will have 1 wire left over (goes to the ecu), just wrap that up or remove it from the harness. The fuel pump relay should only be there if your going to use the resistor pack. If not, ditch it because it will end up sending full voltage through a really thin gauge wire and will end up burning out the realy.

[lagos]

99GT, there are 2 wires that go from the alternators ring terminal, all the way through the harness, and then split off into 3 wires that go to your fuse box.



The best thing to do is not to cut those and just take them out of the 6th gen harness and loom them in with the 3sgte harness. That way you dont have to try to solder those thick wires.

If you want to take out the whole harness, its pretty simple. You just have to remove the throttle body, sometimes possibly the fuel rail (though I have gotten it past the rail without removing it before). Then get under the car and unplug a few things from the back of the motor, and the harness will slide right out.

Edit: actually, you have a 5sfe right? Then you'll also have to take your valve cover off to get the harness out.

This post has been edited by lagos: Dec 25, 2008 - 10:32 AM

[99GT]

My wires are burnt completely in two so I have to replace them. Damn it.

[presure2]

Manny... to ditch the fuel pump relay, take the 3 blue wires and solder them together. Then you will have 1 wire left over (goes to the ecu), just wrap that up or remove it from the harness. The fuel pump relay should only be there if your going to use the resistor pack. If not, ditch it because it will end up sending full voltage through a really thin gauge wire and will end up burning out the realy.

perfect.
thanks.

[lagos]

My wires are burnt completely in two so I have to replace them. Damn it.

You could attempt to just repair that section by cutting off the burnt out wiring and joining the fresh wiring together. Then add on an extra alternator wire to help beef up your wiring like so...
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=64220

[WannabeGT4]

Nice to see people doing it the right way. It's been a couple years since I did mine but if you want some help with the write up Lagos let me know.