FWD 6GC Oversteer?, Why am I experiencing oversteer? Options

[Special_Edy]

So if any of you read my post in the "Today I..." topic you know that I had a mishap on the highway the other day. Well I drove past the skid marks and its quite clear I locked up the back wheels for about 10 feet and then the car went into a spin. Then, yesterday, I took the car along some super twisty country roads and was experiencing oversteer. When I went around a corner at a fair speed, the rear end was swinging out slightly, even with me gassing it out of the turns. Its actually very pleasant getting the rearend out maybe 5°-10°, as our cars are extremely stable and oversteer is WAY better than understeer. It just comes as a suprise to me. Im used to this car understeering as any FWD car is prone to do. My tires are crap but they all have decent tread on them and are properly inflated, and my alignment is slightly off but Ive gotten cars back from the alignment shop worse than it.

So any ideas? Do yall experience oversteer or understeer? I guess I need to start doing some autocross and really get the feel for this vehicle.

[Culpable04]

the only thing I can think of are.

Rear sway bar upgraded ?
or brake system issue where one or both of your rear calipers is seize and thus applying brakes at all time ? GT ? ebrake shoes ? maybe. the only way to force a FWD to oversteer is by playing with the ebrake, so any type of rear wheel braking would make the car do that. I would start there.

This post has been edited by Culpable04: Apr 20, 2012 - 11:33 AM

[BonzaiCelica]

its the other way around.

prevent oversteer you must get thicker front sway bar

prevent understeer you must get thicker rear sway bar

[Special_Edy]

the only thing I can think of are.

Rear sway bar upgraded ?
or brake system issue where one or both of your rear calipers is seize and thus applying brakes at all time ? GT ? ebrake shoes ? maybe. the only way to force a FWD to oversteer is by playing with the ebrake, so any type of rear wheel braking would make the car do that. I would start there.

I will have to jack it up and see if they are dragging when I get home, but its just like im going around a turn not touching the gas/brake and the rear end scoots out a little bit. Didnt catch me off gaurd but it really surprised me.

That and like I said it actually felt kindof good. Its a little scary when you get the rear end out on a RWD but with the FWD(Which im still mastering, been driving RWD all my life) it was totally stable about it. But its ultimately a loss of traction which is never a good thing, and these were banked curves at 30 to 40mph where as the speed limit is 30 and the suggested speed(yellow sign) is 20. Its not like I was ripping the e brake through a 90° turn. So I dunno, felt super strange and I definately need to get to the bottom of it.

[mak5603]

You on poorly dampened coils?

[kurt95gt]

My 94 st an my 90 gt were both tailhappy
My 95 gt seems to stay alil more planted but i still feel the rear slip before the front
ive alway chalked it up to them being alittle light in the rear

[Special_Edy]

You on poorly dampened coils?

To my knowledge Im on the original suspension and my first thought was the rear struts but it seems to happen on left turns as well as right. If I grab the car and shake it/bounce it as hard as I can the sway bars seem to work excellent(I can only twist the body side to side a half inch) and the dampners seem to be doing their job(I can push the car down 2 inches and it will spring back to normal and stop, not bouncy like a bad shock). So I dunno. Guess Im gonna have to lift the car and do some looking and prying to try to locate the problem. I wish I could find an alignment shop that is capable of at least half-assing their job. Goodyear lost my business after their total incompetance with my Lincoln's alignment. I took it to them 3 times before I ended up doing it myself

[dudeofchaos]

Weird as the only time I lost control of the car was when I aquaplanned, the front never lost it's grip even with almost flat tires but the rear with ok tread swang a whole 120degree. I wasn't even speeding.

[Culpable04]

its the other way around.

prevent oversteer you must get thicker front sway bar

prevent understeer you must get thicker rear sway bar

you got it right and so did I, I meant, his car maybe doing that because it has a thicker rear sway bar. sorry if that didn't come across clearly.

EDIT, now that I think about it, either a Thicker rear sway bar or removing your front sway bar ( Very dangerous ) so check your front sway bar, make sure is secure in place etc.

This post has been edited by Culpable04: Apr 20, 2012 - 1:23 PM

[Special_Edy]

its the other way around.

prevent oversteer you must get thicker front sway bar

prevent understeer you must get thicker rear sway bar

you got it right and so did I, I meant, his car maybe doing that because it has a thicker rear sway bar. sorry if that didn't come across clearly.

EDIT, now that I think about it, either a Thicker rear sway bar or removing your front sway bar ( Very dangerous ) so check your front sway bar, make sure is secure in place etc.

Makes sense that whichever corner rolls less is going to loose traction quicker. The looser end is going to keep contact better

This post has been edited by Special_Edy: Apr 20, 2012 - 1:47 PM

[6gcer]

+1 on checking front sway bar. How many miles do you have on the original suspension? Might need a suspension overhaul.

[Special_Edy]

+1 on checking front sway bar. How many miles do you have on the original suspension? Might need a suspension overhaul.

118 thousand, it is 18 years old though

[6gcer]

118 thousand, it is 18 years old though

Worn struts maybe contributing to your problem.

[Special_Edy]

I wonder if the fuel level has any affect on the handling. Gonna have to try full tank vs empty tank to see. Id bet that the higher moment of inertia with a full tank(9lbs x 12 gallons = apx 108 lbs) will offset the additional traction of the added weight. But we shall see... Theory means nothing till the rubber meets the pavement

[mkernz22]

Are you still on the stock tires?
I have 225/55/17 on my car, all season tires, 10mm spacers in the rear / 5mm in the front, and just rear end links. Everything else is stock.
I can take off ramps (depending on the sharpness and angle) at about 40 - 60 mph, and the car doesn't slide at all.
Obviously if I cut into a corner hard, I can get the rear end to break loose a bit.

I feel like it could be your tires, especially if you are still on the stock rims and the tires aren't the best. Having wider wheels with spacers gives me a better center of gravity so it will grip the road better.

(Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong about that, it's just what I've heard from a few people)

[Bitter]

with 18 years and over 100K miles the stock struts are toast. On any car.

[Spider77]

Real question is...(since im local..sorta), which twisty roads we talking about?