supras are suposed to be fast right? Options

[Justin8358]

atleast thats what im told.
what engine is in the supra?
i was about to ask if anyone has put a supra engine in a celica but then i remembered the supra was RWD
so who thinks it would be possible to make a calica RWD using the supra for parts?

[richee3]

This thread should be in the Engine/Transmission/Maintenance section, just so you know. Second, the Supra engine is a 2JZ-GTE. It's set up for RWD. You CAN put it in a Celica, but then your Celica isn't really a Celica anymore. You've cut the firewall and put Supra suspension in the front end of your car to handle the weight. There are lots of reasons why you shouldn't and other reasons why you can't. I'll just sum it up by saying that by the time you've done all the work and spent the money necessary to do this, you've already spent enough money to buy a Supra. And you're better off with the Supra.

http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=1311

Why The 2JZ-GTE Isn't Feasible


At the behest of Coomer, and myself, I'm writing this sticky so hopefully people will stop asking about this swap. Please read all of this, and if it doesn't answer your questions about this issue, PM me, please don't post on the board, you'll just get flamed, most likely by me. If you read it all and still have questions, PM, don't post!

The question asked: Can I swap a 2JZ-GTE engine (from a 93-98 Supra Twin Turbo) into my 6th Generation Celica?

The answer: Yes, but that's not a good question.

The question that SHOULD be asked instead: Can I swap a 2JZ-GTE engine (from a 93-98 Supra Twin Turbo) into my 6th Generation Celica and STILL KEEP it a Celica.

The answer to this better question: No.

The first question addressed to all of you who take the "with enough money, anything is possible" stance, which is a legitimate one. Yes, you could cut through the firewall, yes you could convert the Celica to rear-wheel-drive, yes, you could do the swap. This is a valid point, but I shudder to guess at how much all this would cost.

Practically speaking, you'd have to buy a complete Twin Turbo Supra to source all the parts you might need (engine, drive-train, and suspension), and if you did that, why not just drive it? You're going to tear apart an amazing car to put the engine in your Celica? What?!!?

Ok, now to address the specifics of why you CAN'T reasonably do this swap:

1) 2JZ-GTE engines are not cheap. You think it's a lot to pay $3,000 for a 3S-GTE clip? A Supra clip will set you back anywhere from $6,000-$10,000. And that's just for the engine. You still have all of the massive custom work, and you need all of the Supra suspension and drive-train, so essentially you need the whole car. If you have 10 grand laying around to put into your Celica, call me, and I will build you the baddest one in the country. There are better ways to spend that money on a 6th Gen Celica.

2) The 2JZ-GTE is an Inline 6 Cylinder engine, mounted longitudinally. The 5S-FE and 7A-FE engines are both 4 cylinders, mounted transversely.

The best way to understand this: open your hood; see how the engine is oriented where the long sides are parallel to the bumper, essentially sideways? The Supra engine is mounted so the long sides are parallel to the fenders. Most rear-wheel-drive sports cars, like the Supra, have their engine mounted longitudinally, whereas front-wheel-drive cars, like the Celica, usually are transverse. This immediately poses the problem of mounting the engine. The Celica engine bay was not meant to ever have a longitudinally mounted engine in it.

3) The 2JZ-GTE is an Inline 6 Cylinder engine. The 7A-FE and 5S-FE are 4 cylinders.

The Supra engine is a LOT bigger that the Celica engines, it is a lot longer. Even if you could overcome the mounting issue (#2) you have the size difference. In order to fit the 2JZ in the Celica bay, you would have to do one of 2 things:

A) Extend the bumper and frame forward about a foot with custom body work, but at the same time destroying the head-on collision safeguards, and also destroying the structural integrity of the Celica frame. Did I mention that this makes the car illegal to drive on the street?
B) Cut into the firewall (the wall between you in the interior and the engine bay), to extend the engine bay to the rear, thus destroying any protection you have against a possible fire (it is called a FIREwall) and again, making the car illegal to drive on the street for a lot of reasons.

At this point I feel I should explain what I mean by "illegal" in the above situations. I'm not talking about emissions/smog, or CARB, or parts meant for "off-road use only." We all know you can get around most of that. I'm talking about "illegal" like the authorities take away the car and don't give it back. You cannot get a car with a cut firewall legally titled in ANY state, no matter who you know, the same for a car with the crash-test safeguards removed. They aren't legally considered cars at this point, just scrap.

4) If those weren't enough to deter you, you still have to convert the Celica to rear-wheel-drive. This is possible, but it will cost a lot of money, and isn't really relevant by this point. If you have come this far successfully, you've paid for at least 2 complete Supra TTs, minimum, probably closer to 3. There are other points I could go into, but by this point, if you aren't insane and Bill Gates, you're out. If not, buy me a Supra! Obviously you have more money than God.

This post has been edited by richee3: Sep 30, 2010 - 10:00 PM

[stephen_lee]

but.. but...


isnt my celica rwd?

[Justin8358]

thanx
that made me laugh
point taken tho.

but.. but...


isnt my celica rwd?

you have a RWD celica?

[stephen_lee]

in reverse. lol

it was sarcasm, sorry kid

[Justin8358]

in reverse. lol

it was sarcasm, sorry kid

thats what thought.
but you might have been serous.
haha

[HectortheRican]

The 2JZGTE is a powerful engine... but truth is, for most race-spec Supras, they swapped it out for a 3SGTE because it's lighter and you can squeeze pretty similar figures out of it

[playr158]

The 2JZGTE is a powerful engine... but truth is, for most race-spec Supras, they swapped it out for a 3SGTE because it's lighter and you can squeeze pretty similar figures out of it

Its actually very few "race spec" with 3sgte.......i know top secret had one making 700whp on a fully built motor...thats about max 3sgte powers. 2jzgte is capable of well into the mid upper 1000s whp.

There are rwd celicas....1 5th gen v8 and a bunch of OEM 1/2/3 gens?

Please go see other hot topic rwd thread...........welcome to the pointless party.. enjoy your stay

[SupraKid]

^this guy^

BWahahhah keep telling yourself that hector...the 2jz and 3sgte are similar YES...IMO 2 of Toyota best engines hands down. BUT when you get to 700whp+ the 2jz takes command. Not to mention the cheapness(comparatively) it would be to get RELIABLE 500+hp figures.. The 3sgte is put into Supras(rarely) for handling, not for power gain.The 2jz HAS been put into a 6gc b4, buts its really not a 6gc anymore as the car is completely tubed and really has no oem 6gc parts left.

Heres your supra lesson for the day:
-mk3(1986.5-1992)-7mgte-240rwhp,7mge-210whp...that engine is a piece of ****....the joke goes "whats the difference between a bucket of coolant and a 7mgte...? the bucket actually holds coolant" because those engines BHG worst than most..
-also the 1jz was offered in japan mk3 supras,it puts down around 280, but ive heard it is torqueless compared to the 7m and 2j.

-mk4(1993-2002)-After Toyota realized how BAD they ****ed up the 7mgte i think they realized they had to make some GOOD performance engines...THIS is the mighty 2jzgtte,320rwhp,no real problems..2jzge had around 220rwhp(almost as much as the 7mgTe)


/Supra lesson


EDIT:OMG your that oakley kid...California law does not allow for changing the wheel drive...Or else the 2jzgtte swap would be legal( yea they are ****ed up). If you get pulled over...they would immediately know that the engine doesn't belong there,as its gonna look really weird...then they will impound your car,check the engine vin VS your vin. Then if your LUCKY ull just get a bigass fine...if you are caught racing or something they will crush your car...

This post has been edited by SupraKid: Oct 1, 2010 - 12:07 AM

[HectortheRican]

I know you can squeeze ungodly amounts of power out of the 2JZ. I've seen over 1,300hp. But I was talking about GT spec, never amount getting the most power. When do you ever see a GT car with more than 500ish hp?? Pretty much never. You don't need massive amounts of power for GT racing. You need stability and handling and great acceleration. That's the only reason I brought up the 3SGTE swaps into GT spec Supras because that's what GT racing is: handling. Get a 800hp 2JZ Supra on the GT tracks and it'll be all over the track. Thanks for proving my point. Keep the 1,000 club 2JZ for the drag strip.

This post has been edited by HectortheRican: Oct 1, 2010 - 12:32 AM

[SupraKid]

GT?As in GRAND touring?The supra was ment to be a GT type of car (after the 2000gt)

Most mk4 enthusiasts have BPUs which puts theyre 2jz at around 450rwhp...And at LEAST 30% are 500rwhp+...and there is a good chunk of mk3 drivers in the 500rwhp club as well..You dont have to touch mk3s internally until around 500 horses..and 2jzs even more..

[SeverX13]

whats a supra?

[HectortheRican]

GT?As in GRAND touring?The supra was ment to be a GT type of car (after the 2000gt)

Most mk4 enthusiasts have BPUs which puts theyre 2jz at around 450rwhp...And at LEAST 30% are 500rwhp+...and there is a good chunk of mk3 drivers in the 500rwhp club as well..You dont have to touch mk3s internally until around 500 horses..and 2jzs even more..

Yes, that's true. I'm saying that the 3SGTE is a viable option and has been done numerous times because it's lighter than the 2JZ and has better weight dist. And if a Supra is GT prepped... they're going to touch it internally whatever amount of horsepower it has. I don't know if you're completely understanding what I'm trying to say... I'm not saying that the 3SGTE can keep up with the 2JZ in terms of horsepower, I know that's not true. I'm saying that a 3SGTE swapped GT Supra will handle better and that's why they do it. Because other than that, what's the point of going from 6 cylinders to 4?

[Random_Stranger]

The 2JZGTE is a powerful engine... but truth is, for most race-spec Supras, they swapped it out for a 3SGTE because it's lighter and you can squeeze pretty similar figures out of it

Very true, one of the top secret Supras do run 3sgte.

[njccmd2002]

whats a supra?

i guess thye are talking bout these, but...but... these are FWD as in "foot wheel drive"

[HectortheRican]

whats a supra?

i guess thye are talking bout these, but...but... these are FWD as in "foot wheel drive"

LOL you make my day happy

[SupraKid]

Obviously they are rpd...(rear prop drive)

[cjh4l22]

atleast thats what im told.
what engine is in the supra?
i was about to ask if anyone has put a supra engine in a celica but then i remembered the supra was RWD
so who thinks it would be possible to make a calica RWD using the supra for parts?

seriously...?

[95CelicaST]

Supra? Why would you want to swap in a 125cc motor?

[SleekCelica]

You want to just throw away your engine and walk, why?



it doesn't say it, but it's supra footwear.

This post has been edited by SleekCelica: Oct 4, 2010 - 6:23 AM