WTA intercooling, For a 6th gen celica forum why arent we talking more about this??? Options

[3WayStunna]

Alright this isnt meant to be a thread where i post a random question and hope for a decent answer...no this thread is more like a info and question dump for those who choose either way.

Lets be honest some of us on this forum own GT4's or we get the WTA intercooling system in front clips and think its all hunky dory to just throw on our cars without any real concise or group info on this....FORUM.....to help us out...

So hows about we get this started...Come on ppl this is about helping each other out and i guess ill start..first off this....my simplistic view..

The real benefits of an WTA system are below.....

***Shorter piping btwn the turbo and intake manifold means less intercooler pressure drop
*** Less intercooler piping
***incredibly less lag time
*** colder intake temps
***more space in engine bay for any type of battery
*** colder engine temps due to more air hitting the radiator (esp if you ditch the aircon)
***running incog-negro...basically no gaudy or tacky FMIC lol.....Sleeper status, etc....

And the drawbacks are this...

*** Weight....the piping etc. not so much but the water will add some LBS..
***complexity....not really to be honest but requires more parts, means more points for failure..only as complex as you want it though..
***weight distribution...more weight on the front of car obviously...

Now a breakdown of the main parts......

***WTA core
***heat exchanger
***PUMP
***misc hoses/fittings/piping etc....

To be honest a decent kit can be setup for around 300-500 usd depending on where you get your parts.
The parts i just ordered were from www.siliconeintakes.com OR www.frozenboost.com ( there the same company btw)

Now while i provided a list of the basic parts and really just one company that sells everything you can order your stuff from, there are alot of other things to consider.

***type of pump and whether you want it to run constantly or at set time
***fans for the radiator
*** hot you will prevent heatsoak of the CORE itself
***where to put all of this stuff....
***type of fittings and whether you will use rubber or silicone to connect your aluminum/steel piping
***type of fluid to be used
*** and the list can go on and on depending on how crazy and exotic you want to go...


And yes all of those above considerations are real world done by myself and many other WELL experianced people in the MR2 an Celica world.....

Guide and link to typical setup..
http://www.haywood-sullivan.com/vana...ler_system.pdf

Details of my celica setup....

***Stock WTA intercooler (wrapped with heatshielding to prevent heatsoak - not in this pic though)
***silicone hose btwn the intecooler and turbo (actually made a differnce in temps/response time...never figured out why though)
***aluminum radiator w/2 small fans wired to a switch
***pump only ran as stock (when throttle signal was present)



Looking to see others post setups of their own or other ideas as i basically posted very simple info regarding WTA setups...there is much that can be covered and even more that has been proven or typed....later on ill post up some info from MR2oc.com and gt4oc.net with respective rights given to the authers to avoid typing up info that has been covered numerous times by people with more experiance and just better typing skills than myself lol..

This post has been edited by 3WayStunna: Jan 12, 2012 - 12:28 AM

[Sunny]

Hi,
after hours, days or month of comparing ATA and WTA i become also a big fan of WTA

there is a further benefit you missed to list, water with his very high specific heat capacity is able to compensate not enough air flow which is the reason why i'am not a using
fans to the pre-radiator, in general you are just in need of a fan when there is not enough air flow

i'am using the following system

- uprated TTE group A spec intercooler (one more row and a different water side)
- TTE swirlpot
- jabsco 80L/min pump (with 54-killer)
- custom pre-radiator with shroud
- higher water amount in the intercooler liquid (1:1,5)
- TRD 1,5bar caps (~110°C boiling point)

here some pictures















greetz

This post has been edited by Sunny: Jan 14, 2012 - 1:03 PM

[Nial]

I made my own charge cooler a few years ago.



fitted & painted



I spent years researching charge cooling, its pros and cons, designs etc etc I run two radiators on my system, a TTE type swirl pot and it works great although the design need to be refined a bit so eventually I wil work on the mk2

[Neon90424]

for 300$ I got this radiator and chargecooler

[stephen_lee]

Im very interested in the W2A setup and when i turbo the V6 thats how im going to go.

[3WayStunna]

Hi,
after hours, days or month of comparing ATA and WTA i become also a big fan of WTA

there is a further benefit you missed to list, water with his very high specific heat capacity is able to compensate not enough air flow which is the reason why i'am not a using
fans to the pre-radiator, in general you are just in need of a fan when there is not enough air flow

i'am using the following system

- uprated TTE group A spec intercooler (one more row and a different water side)
- TTE swirlpot
- jabsco 80L/min pump (with 54-killer)
- custom pre-radiator with shroud
- higher water amount in the intercooler liquid (1:1,5)
- TRD 1,5bar caps (~110°C boiling point)

here some pictures















greetz

Sunny what a great setup you have. How do you like the jabsco pump and are you running it constant?
Anywho you also made alot of good points, one in regards to water's ability to take a while to "heat up" versus air and even in your spec list. Could you possibly explain for others sake why you choose some of what you have in your setup. Like why the jabsco pump versus some of the cheapest out there and why a swirlpot in a WTA setup. (btw i would like to say something on it but i think you could word it better than me ^_^)

Personally i feel like i should explain why i choose to use fans in my own setup. Basically it was due to the area on the world i was in. I daily drove my car and for those who do or dont know, the 205's pump only runs when the throttle signal is present. Otherwise the water can just sit there keeping the heat it should be loosing. So all of the water that was sitting in my larger radiator was getting cool air over whenever my car was sitting (which was at least 70% of the time).

So i guess it can be said that these setups could use some imagination depending on how your car/engine will be used..

[3WayStunna]

I made my own charge cooler a few years ago.



fitted & painted



I spent years researching charge cooling, its pros and cons, designs etc etc I run two radiators on my system, a TTE type swirl pot and it works great although the design need to be refined a bit so eventually I wil work on the mk2

Yes i remember reading through your threadso n the GT4OC.....Anywho so how is the MKI holding up since you have made it? And what are your plans with the MKII? Btw ill link your threado n GT4OC for others to read if you dont mind...
http://www.gt4oc.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=74267

Beautiful setup by the way...hope my next two jobs come out looking as good as yours..also like the stock you have given the intercooler...

for 300$ I got this radiator and chargecooler

Neon how do you expect your system to hold up for what you are using your car for...i mean it looks like your building a drag car to be honest....Maybe adding a swirlpot/ or resevoir is in your thoughts as well?

This post has been edited by 3WayStunna: Jan 17, 2012 - 1:23 AM

[Nial]

Anywho so how is the MKI holding up since you have made it? And what are your plans with the MKII?

Its still going strong thanks, one of the legs suffered a stress fracture, but soon had it welded back together. need to refit it one day as the standard cooler is on at the moment.

The MK2 will be designed to look more like the original charge cooler, just deeper with a better core.

[Neon90424]

that rad is for the chargecooler...it should hold up fine the chargecooler is rated to 1000hp supposedly Im going for 500 maybe more with nitrous...and I can also freeze my rad with CO2 before drags...

[Sunny]

Hi 3WayStunna,

i'am happy with the pump, and bought her becouse i was in know that this pump will fit the OEM bracket
no one problem in three years except when i changed for the TTE intercooler

i found that the pump now takes more ampere nearly 30A instead of ~24A and the level sensor was always activ
so i decided to drop the sensor out and pluged the hole with a ST185 intercooler insert, i should also say that after i
changed for the custom front radiator the amperes dropes down to 18-20A

i found the throttle body activation is pretty good, a slight tough to the pedal and the pump is running for ~20sec iirc,
so no i run my pump not constant
do not overrate the heat soak, there is no need for a intercooler once the throttle isn't pushed becouse there is no air to cool down
that little heat from the engine is pretty fast in the pre-radiator to cool down, but in fact i doesn't know south korea and his climate
(except that one he has to north korea )


i doesn't really know why i mounted the swirlpot, i think i just want it, there are a few small advantages
- highest point, my intercooler is full with water without spending hours of bleeding air out
- higher water volume in the system
- self air bleeding (if there is any left)

i did the front radiator becouse

the oem one was damaged



i think the jabsco pump was the reason for the open clamps, no problem i fixed the radiator in a hour or so and then i started to do a welding caliber
for the new radiator and then it happens, the electricity runs over the radator fins and destroyed them non repairable, sh*t happens

the advantages are

- a uprated radiator for the uprated intercooler (-> the heat that goes in the system must go out too)
- higher water volume (takes more heat until it raises his temp.)

unfortunetly i doesn't have any compareable values of the OEM system against my uprated system, i just can say that i hit fuel cut when it is
colder like in fall at night (central europe= 5-10°C), even i doesn't use a boost controller any more (just a 3" exhaust until the middle of the car)

i hope that i doesn't forgett anything to answer and feel free to drop me any question

greetz

This post has been edited by Sunny: Jan 17, 2012 - 5:42 PM

[Neon90424]

Unfortunately the huge chargecooler didn't fit under my hood there is literally NO WHERE i can put it...